Help With Il Ceppo Markings

Pipe and other hardware related discussions
Post Reply
User avatar
Goose55
Del's Love Child
Del's Love Child
Posts: 4704
Joined: Thu Feb 11, 2016 6:44 pm
Location: Southern Arizona, U.S.A.

Help With Il Ceppo Markings

Post by Goose55 » Wed Aug 02, 2017 6:27 pm

I have this estate il Ceppo coming and I am wondering about the markings, as to grading. What does the large "G" mean? I did a little research online, and it was confusing. I also looked in the library here but could not find anything.

Image
Last edited by Goose55 on Wed Aug 02, 2017 8:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"At present we're on the wrong side of the door. But all the pages of the New Testament are rustling with the rumor that it will not always be so." ~ C.S. Lewis

User avatar
DepartedLight
That boy's got a Thorazine deficiency.
Posts: 25386
Joined: Thu Nov 19, 2009 6:00 pm
Location: Tobacco Fairy HQ, North Carolina

Re: Help With Il Ceppo Markings

Post by DepartedLight » Wed Aug 02, 2017 6:59 pm

bump. good schtuff, goose man
DL Jake

All my posts should be viewed from a position of, this guy is nuts.

I missed throwing up in 2016. » tuttle

User avatar
Goose55
Del's Love Child
Del's Love Child
Posts: 4704
Joined: Thu Feb 11, 2016 6:44 pm
Location: Southern Arizona, U.S.A.

Re: Help With Il Ceppo Markings

Post by Goose55 » Wed Aug 02, 2017 8:44 pm

Il Ceppo collectors among us, can you shed some light on the markings of that pipe? There is no triangle anywhere, with a number.
"At present we're on the wrong side of the door. But all the pages of the New Testament are rustling with the rumor that it will not always be so." ~ C.S. Lewis

User avatar
sweetandsour
Minister of Pipe Breaking
Minister of Pipe Breaking
Posts: 7653
Joined: Sun Oct 12, 2008 6:00 pm
Location: Bayou Self
Contact:

Re: Help With Il Ceppo Markings

Post by sweetandsour » Wed Aug 02, 2017 9:48 pm

I was always told the big "G" could stand for God, George, or geometry.
As thus we sat in darkness
Each one busy with his prayers,
"We are lost!" the captain shouted,
As he staggered down the stairs.

O love the Lord, all ye His saints: for the Lord preserveth the faithful. Psalm 31:23

User avatar
Goose55
Del's Love Child
Del's Love Child
Posts: 4704
Joined: Thu Feb 11, 2016 6:44 pm
Location: Southern Arizona, U.S.A.

Re: Help With Il Ceppo Markings

Post by Goose55 » Wed Aug 02, 2017 10:03 pm

sweetandsour wrote:
Wed Aug 02, 2017 9:48 pm
I was always told the big "G" could stand for God, George, or geometry.
Maybe, but not in Il Ceppo pipes
"At present we're on the wrong side of the door. But all the pages of the New Testament are rustling with the rumor that it will not always be so." ~ C.S. Lewis

User avatar
Goose55
Del's Love Child
Del's Love Child
Posts: 4704
Joined: Thu Feb 11, 2016 6:44 pm
Location: Southern Arizona, U.S.A.

Re: Help With Il Ceppo Markings

Post by Goose55 » Thu Aug 03, 2017 8:22 pm

No one with knowledge of Il Ceppo grading markings among us?
"At present we're on the wrong side of the door. But all the pages of the New Testament are rustling with the rumor that it will not always be so." ~ C.S. Lewis

User avatar
Rusty
Come and see the violence inherent in the system!
Come and see the violence inherent in the system!
Posts: 24938
Joined: Thu May 01, 2008 6:00 pm
Location: Beelzebub's Rare Tobacco Emporium

Re: Help With Il Ceppo Markings

Post by Rusty » Fri Aug 04, 2017 12:08 am

Goose55 wrote:
Thu Aug 03, 2017 8:22 pm
No one with knowledge of Il Ceppo grading markings among us?
Aren't we demanding tonight. Not all of us are on all the time. You should ask who owns or owned Il Ceppos or maybe sold them in retail. Those with larger, rambling, collections are more likely to have smaller audience brands like Il Ceppo. I certainly enjoy mine. They market both classic shaped pipes and other somewhat freehand shapes that are interesting. Mine are very good smokers.

That appears to be a so called first period Il Ceppo. First period pipes are older ie from late 70's through to the mid 90's or so. Very small audience at the time. I don't have any that are that old because I bought mine brand new well after 2000 and they were not distributed in Canada. The stamping looks a little different on the modern ones. But you can guess at some of it on yours. The G (which is the letter in the range of A-H that precedes the digits) probably is indicating a rusticated pipe. Why? It's closer to H than it is to A and the pipe is obviously rusticated. A straight grain would be one of A-D or E and there are examples on the web. I don't know how to interpret the digits that follow. They don't obviously look like a date encoding. They may encode shape and/or other things (eg market). The modern designation is a circled 9 for the same grade and they lack the series of digits preceded by a letter. There should also be a number within a triangle. It's called a group number within the first period pipes. Don't sweat the confusion. Most people are confused by Il Ceppos strange stamping. It's part of the charm. The brand has a much more limited audience than some others. They weren't always consistent with their stamping. It's not hard to find pipes with some of the stamping missing, for example.

Bob was working in the retail end of the biz at the tail end of the first period so he may have some more information. Also RD Field was the importer and he is another good source and he does respond to emails.
Last edited by Rusty on Fri Aug 04, 2017 1:23 am, edited 3 times in total.
A mood rises just to have.

Though it is not too sweet, the citreous marble design is refreshing womanfully, and a mood rises just to have.


~ Pen review (Onishi-seisakusho Fountain pen Acetate Lemon) on a Japanese site

Image

User avatar
Sir Moose
President Jar-Jar Binks fan club: "Meesa tink he da best!" - Perpetually in Trouble
President Jar-Jar Binks fan club: "Meesa tink he da best!" - Perpetually in Trouble
Posts: 2460
Joined: Tue Mar 03, 2015 1:17 am
Location: NW Washington
Contact:

Re: Help With Il Ceppo Markings

Post by Sir Moose » Fri Aug 04, 2017 12:39 am

You could try contacting this guy who claims to have known Mario Lubinski, the distributor for Il Ceppo pipes in Italy, for over 30 years. I don't know if he'd be willing to give you any insight or not, but it would only cost you a few keystrokes to find out.
In theory, theory and practice are the same. In practice, they are not.

User avatar
Cleon
Brother of the Briar
Brother of the Briar
Posts: 13689
Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 6:00 pm
Location: Indiana - South of 40
Contact:

Re: Help With Il Ceppo Markings

Post by Cleon » Fri Aug 04, 2017 7:36 am

I was going to say what Rusty basically said. The letter indicates grade. The lower in the alphabet, the higher the grade. The higher in the alphabet, the lower the grade. Your pipe is rusticated because it didn't have the bones to make a higher grade, so they rusticate it, grade it accordingly, and then they can sell it at a reasonable price point.
"Let the little children come to Me, and do not forbid them; for of such is the kingdom of heaven" - Jesus

"More people need to put their big boy britches on." - JMG

"Dang, a pipe slap." - JimVH

User avatar
Goose55
Del's Love Child
Del's Love Child
Posts: 4704
Joined: Thu Feb 11, 2016 6:44 pm
Location: Southern Arizona, U.S.A.

Re: Help With Il Ceppo Markings

Post by Goose55 » Fri Aug 04, 2017 9:13 am

Thanks Rusty, Moose, and Cleon.
"At present we're on the wrong side of the door. But all the pages of the New Testament are rustling with the rumor that it will not always be so." ~ C.S. Lewis

User avatar
Goose55
Del's Love Child
Del's Love Child
Posts: 4704
Joined: Thu Feb 11, 2016 6:44 pm
Location: Southern Arizona, U.S.A.

Re: Help With Il Ceppo Markings

Post by Goose55 » Fri Aug 04, 2017 11:44 am

Cleon wrote:
Fri Aug 04, 2017 7:36 am
I was going to say what Rusty basically said. The letter indicates grade. The lower in the alphabet, the higher the grade. The higher in the alphabet, the lower the grade. Your pipe is rusticated because it didn't have the bones to make a higher grade, so they rusticate it, grade it accordingly, and then they can sell it at a reasonable price point.
But this other Il Ceppo I have, a "Freeline Straight Grain," also has a large "G" to the left of the numbers (just as the rusticated one above), and it does not appear to be a low grade pipe. Does it?.....

Image

Image
"At present we're on the wrong side of the door. But all the pages of the New Testament are rustling with the rumor that it will not always be so." ~ C.S. Lewis

User avatar
UncleBob
CPS Theological Dogmatician
CPS Theological Dogmatician
Posts: 32274
Joined: Tue Aug 03, 2004 6:00 pm
Location: Lubbock, TX USA
Contact:

Re: Help With Il Ceppo Markings

Post by UncleBob » Fri Aug 04, 2017 4:07 pm

The "G", as was told to me (and therefore suspect because not all pipe importers really know), means that it was made by Giorgio Imperatori. Supposedly the stock on hand was marked with a "G" when Giorgio retired and when Franco took over. Now, I never vetted this lore as Il Ceppo never was a priority for us at JFH.
"One man's theology is another man's belly laugh." - Robert A. Heinlein

"Many of the points here, taken to their logical conclusions, don't hold up to logic; they're simply Godded-up ways of saying "I don't like that." - Skip

User avatar
Rusty
Come and see the violence inherent in the system!
Come and see the violence inherent in the system!
Posts: 24938
Joined: Thu May 01, 2008 6:00 pm
Location: Beelzebub's Rare Tobacco Emporium

Re: Help With Il Ceppo Markings

Post by Rusty » Fri Aug 04, 2017 4:27 pm

Goose55 wrote:
Fri Aug 04, 2017 11:44 am
Cleon wrote:
Fri Aug 04, 2017 7:36 am
I was going to say what Rusty basically said. The letter indicates grade. The lower in the alphabet, the higher the grade. The higher in the alphabet, the lower the grade. Your pipe is rusticated because it didn't have the bones to make a higher grade, so they rusticate it, grade it accordingly, and then they can sell it at a reasonable price point.
But this other Il Ceppo I have, a "Freeline Straight Grain," also has a large "G" to the left of the numbers (just as the rusticated one above), and it does not appear to be a low grade pipe. Does it?.....

Image

Image
Looks like an "E" to me. And this coupled with Bob's story tells us just how very critical the stamping is to the proper operation of the pipe. So much so that they didn't document it. And this is not unusual.
LOL!
I bought Il Ceppo's brand new and the enclosed info sheet did not explain any of this. But mine did not have the obscure "G" so maybe that's appropriate. Who knows what happened to Georgio.

Like many of us you seem to have little difficulty recognizing the grade of the pipe unaided by stamping hints. If you had bought it new with packaging etc and paid the full fare you would have no doubt about the grade. But do not despair. There are puzzles on our pipes for our amusement, myth-making, and sometimes, mysteriously, in service of a warranty. You can imagine John Loring some 40 or 50 years ago discovering that nobody really understood Dunhill pipe stamping and he made it his ambition to rectify that. He succeeded. It is understood today. You can do likewise. There are still puzzles. And you know there is no help. The stamping isn't always intended for the consumer.
A mood rises just to have.

Though it is not too sweet, the citreous marble design is refreshing womanfully, and a mood rises just to have.


~ Pen review (Onishi-seisakusho Fountain pen Acetate Lemon) on a Japanese site

Image

User avatar
Goose55
Del's Love Child
Del's Love Child
Posts: 4704
Joined: Thu Feb 11, 2016 6:44 pm
Location: Southern Arizona, U.S.A.

Re: Help With Il Ceppo Markings

Post by Goose55 » Fri Aug 04, 2017 6:53 pm

Rusty wrote:
Fri Aug 04, 2017 4:27 pm
Looks like an "E" to me.
As I look at it with a magnifying glass, it may well be a "B." The font that was used in the stamping isn't helpful.

When the rusticated version arrives, I will do a close comparison, between their "G" and "B.".I have a macro lens also headed my way that will help.
"At present we're on the wrong side of the door. But all the pages of the New Testament are rustling with the rumor that it will not always be so." ~ C.S. Lewis

User avatar
Rusty
Come and see the violence inherent in the system!
Come and see the violence inherent in the system!
Posts: 24938
Joined: Thu May 01, 2008 6:00 pm
Location: Beelzebub's Rare Tobacco Emporium

Re: Help With Il Ceppo Markings

Post by Rusty » Fri Aug 04, 2017 9:53 pm

Goose55 wrote:
Fri Aug 04, 2017 6:53 pm
Rusty wrote:
Fri Aug 04, 2017 4:27 pm
Looks like an "E" to me.
As I look at it with a magnifying glass, it may well be a "B." The font that was used in the stamping isn't helpful.

When the rusticated version arrives, I will do a close comparison, between their "G" and "B.".I have a macro lens also headed my way that will help.
We know with certainty that they're not all G's, despite Bob's interesting story. There are pics on the web of other letters evident in first period pipes and we're told by the denizens of tubes that A-H is possible. It looks reasonable. What we're missing is an explanation of the letters from Il Ceppo or a distributor etc. That is your homework.

My personal preference is that the G is an index-free Einstein tensor. Somehow quite a good fit for a pipe. This is all about geometry.

It's also interesting to look at stamping and symbols in trademarks on pipes. The richest and most complex seems to be associated with marketing companies (ie they're selling you a lifestyle) vs. technical / product companies that are selling you a product. I would have guessed that Il Ceppo was a product company. But that first period stamping could only have come from a committee.

The clear finished one shown is again a first period Il Ceppo.

I think it's interesting that you're finding Il Ceppo pipes, and older ones esp. I'm pretty sure that I mentioned them. They are one maker in a region of pipe makers most of whom have a related corporate genealogy. So they are a community. Look up the other brands that are from Pesaro. It may broaden your search to add some other brands. The other well know area is Milan / Como. Can you guess who this includes? There is a world of pipes in Italy.

I tripped over an interesting option with google maps that actually showed the locations of all the pipe makers with businesses in Italy. I can't even guess how many hours I burned up on that. Seeing them physically, geographically, is quite a revelation & makes one revisit pics of the pipes to see how they relate. Aside from the time this is quite economical.
A mood rises just to have.

Though it is not too sweet, the citreous marble design is refreshing womanfully, and a mood rises just to have.


~ Pen review (Onishi-seisakusho Fountain pen Acetate Lemon) on a Japanese site

Image

Post Reply