The Climate Change Thread

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UncleBob
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Re: The Climate Change Thread

Post by UncleBob » Wed Sep 12, 2018 1:29 pm

tuttle wrote:
Wed Sep 12, 2018 1:20 pm
UncleBob wrote:
Wed Sep 12, 2018 1:04 pm
6 Years Ago, North Carolina Chose To Ignore Rising Sea Levels. This Week It Braces For Disaster.
In 2012, North Carolina legislators passed a bill that barred policymakers and developers from using up-to-date climate science to plan for rising sea levels on the state’s coast. Now Hurricane Florence threatens to cause a devastating storm surge that could put thousands of lives in danger and cost the state billions of dollars worth of damage.
Man, it's a good thing they saved all that money by not investing it into pseudoscience climate prevention scheme. Sounds like wise financial thinking to me.
Ha! We will see in how much it costs to rebuild--if it hits.
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Re: The Climate Change Thread

Post by Goose55 » Wed Sep 12, 2018 2:02 pm

The fact that Florence is the largest hurricane to make landfall so far north is due to historic warm ocean temperatures. Why has the ocean become so warm? Just a fluke of nature?
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Re: The Climate Change Thread

Post by JimVH » Wed Sep 12, 2018 2:07 pm

Goose55 wrote:
Wed Sep 12, 2018 2:02 pm
The fact that Florence is the largest hurricane to make landfall so far north is due to historic warm ocean temperatures. Why has the ocean become so warm? Just a fluke of nature?
Too many tourists peeing in the water.

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Re: The Climate Change Thread

Post by John-Boy » Wed Sep 12, 2018 2:20 pm

JimVH wrote:
Wed Sep 12, 2018 2:07 pm
Goose55 wrote:
Wed Sep 12, 2018 2:02 pm
The fact that Florence is the largest hurricane to make landfall so far north is due to historic warm ocean temperatures. Why has the ocean become so warm? Just a fluke of nature?
Too many tourists peeing in the water.
Is that against the rules?
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Re: The Climate Change Thread

Post by joshbowyer » Wed Sep 12, 2018 2:33 pm

Something that climatologists conveniently ignore is solar radiation. Namely, the kind that varies in 11, 88, and 200-year cycles. When you line up the global temperatures with the larger solar cycles, you see that there is an incredibly clear link between the Maunder Minimum and the Little Ice Age, the Medieval Warm Period and a solar maximum, etc. The ENSO, PDO, and AMO systems (that are responsible for oceanic-driven weather patterns including El Nino/La Nina) are primarily driven by solar energy. An increase in energy basically results in less powerful trade winds (as the energy pumps the airstream up away from the earth and then back down at 30 degrees + and -), which results in the water in the Pacific stagnating and being allowed to accumulate more thermal energy than "usual", which then changes the ranges of the polar and tropical effects on the jetstream.

So basically warm or crazy weather = sun farts. And wouldn't you know, NASA and friends were saying about 15 years ago that we were in an 88 year solar cycle that was the highest it has been in "over 8,000 years" (which we've just come out of end of last year).

Expect things to cool back down, especially as we've entered a new "minimum" cycle, just like the Maunder Minimum that just so *happened* to coincide with the Mini Ice Age.

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Re: The Climate Change Thread

Post by JimVH » Wed Sep 12, 2018 2:33 pm

John-Boy wrote:
Wed Sep 12, 2018 2:20 pm
JimVH wrote:
Wed Sep 12, 2018 2:07 pm
Goose55 wrote:
Wed Sep 12, 2018 2:02 pm
The fact that Florence is the largest hurricane to make landfall so far north is due to historic warm ocean temperatures. Why has the ocean become so warm? Just a fluke of nature?
Too many tourists peeing in the water.
Is that against the rules?
Goodness, I hope not.

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Re: The Climate Change Thread

Post by John-Boy » Wed Sep 12, 2018 2:34 pm

JimVH wrote:
Wed Sep 12, 2018 2:33 pm
John-Boy wrote:
Wed Sep 12, 2018 2:20 pm
JimVH wrote:
Wed Sep 12, 2018 2:07 pm
Goose55 wrote:
Wed Sep 12, 2018 2:02 pm
The fact that Florence is the largest hurricane to make landfall so far north is due to historic warm ocean temperatures. Why has the ocean become so warm? Just a fluke of nature?
Too many tourists peeing in the water.
Is that against the rules?
Goodness, I hope not.
Whew!
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Re: The Climate Change Thread

Post by durangopipe » Wed Sep 12, 2018 3:26 pm

joshbowyer wrote:
Wed Sep 12, 2018 2:33 pm
Something that climatologists conveniently ignore is solar radiation. Namely, the kind that varies in 11, 88, and 200-year cycles. When you line up the global temperatures with the larger solar cycles, you see that there is an incredibly clear link between the Maunder Minimum and the Little Ice Age, the Medieval Warm Period and a solar maximum, etc. The ENSO, PDO, and AMO systems (that are responsible for oceanic-driven weather patterns including El Nino/La Nina) are primarily driven by solar energy. An increase in energy basically results in less powerful trade winds (as the energy pumps the airstream up away from the earth and then back down at 30 degrees + and -), which results in the water in the Pacific stagnating and being allowed to accumulate more thermal energy than "usual", which then changes the ranges of the polar and tropical effects on the jetstream.

So basically warm or crazy weather = sun farts. And wouldn't you know, NASA and friends were saying about 15 years ago that we were in an 88 year solar cycle that was the highest it has been in "over 8,000 years" (which we've just come out of end of last year).

Expect things to cool back down, especially as we've entered a new "minimum" cycle, just like the Maunder Minimum that just so *happened* to coincide with the Mini Ice Age.
https://www.scientificamerican.com/arti ... te-change/
Many climate scientists agree that sunspots and solar wind could be playing a role in climate change, but the vast majority view it as very minimal and attribute Earth’s warming primarily to emissions from industrial activity—and they have thousands of peer-reviewed studies available to back up that claim.
Not ignored by climatologists.
One of many inputs accounted for in climate change models.
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Re: The Climate Change Thread

Post by joshbowyer » Wed Sep 12, 2018 4:13 pm

It's not, actually. They currently say "there's not enough evidence to show that it has any effect on climate". Except it is the ONLY metric that actually correlates closely to climate data.

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Re: The Climate Change Thread

Post by durangopipe » Wed Sep 12, 2018 4:54 pm

joshbowyer wrote:
Wed Sep 12, 2018 4:13 pm
It's not, actually. They currently say "there's not enough evidence to show that it has any effect on climate". Except it is the ONLY metric that actually correlates closely to climate data.

One excerpt, among a great many:
“NASA” wrote:To understand the processes involved, we recently completed an extensive series of climate model experiments, involving 1600 simulated years with varying UV and total solar irradiance (TSI).
It is, actually. If “they” means the many credible researchers doing climate science, “they” say no such thing. And there is another metric that corresponds far more closely given current conditions (in scientific consensus) and that is carbon in the atmosphere

https://www.giss.nasa.gov/research/briefs/rind_03/

I suspect your sources are somewhat slanted toward climate change denial, josh.
Be willing to read more broadly, and with an open mind.

Even a brief brief search will indicate that this input (solar cycle variation) and many others have been, and are being, studied extensively. The more the phenomenon is studied the more clear it becomes that the primary driver of current, rapid climate change is anthropogenic.

It can be argued that there are a few credible scientists who disagree (very few), but it cannot be reasonably argued that this particular input (or any of a number of others often cited by those who argue against current climate science consensus) have not been examined.

Scientists have examined solar activity as a driver of climate change and concluded that it is not likely a significant factor.

And after this post, I’m out.

It would be pointless to find and list the overwhelming number of studies and the huge amount of data accumulated in the past decade, and even more pointless to try to convince someone disinclined to even accept the very contents of current scientific consensus, let alone the more problematic matter of accepting the consensus itself.

Personally, I’m far more concerned (in regard to the return of low level solar activity) about what declining solar cycles mean for HF propagation and DXing in the coming years!
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Re: The Climate Change Thread

Post by DepartedLight » Wed Sep 12, 2018 5:13 pm

Hello, Climate. Why don't you change into something more comfortable and I'll find us some nice music. Do you have wine in the 'fridge?
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Re: The Climate Change Thread

Post by durangopipe » Wed Sep 12, 2018 5:33 pm

DepartedLight wrote:
Wed Sep 12, 2018 5:13 pm
Hello, Climate. Why don't you change into something more comfortable and I'll find us some nice music. Do you have wine in the 'fridge?
Good post, DL.

It was the, “It’s not, actually,” that drew the stronger response.

Welcome, josh.
We’ve all been around the block on this a few times.

Climate is definitely changing around here.
Seems like the oak on the mountain behind us changed color in a single day.
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Re: The Climate Change Thread

Post by Thunktank » Wed Sep 12, 2018 5:35 pm

DepartedLight wrote:
Wed Sep 12, 2018 5:13 pm
Hello, Climate. Why don't you change into something more comfortable and I'll find us some nice music. Do you have wine in the 'fridge?
Beer, it's got to be beer, a cold, crisp beer. Texas is definately hot enough, it needs to cool down.
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Re: The Climate Change Thread

Post by DepartedLight » Wed Sep 12, 2018 6:36 pm

Thunktank wrote:
Wed Sep 12, 2018 5:35 pm
DepartedLight wrote:
Wed Sep 12, 2018 5:13 pm
Hello, Climate. Why don't you change into something more comfortable and I'll find us some nice music. Do you have wine in the 'fridge?
Beer, it's got to be beer, a cold, crisp beer. Texas is definately hot enough, it needs to cool down.
I met Ms. Climate in Austin. OK?
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Re: The Climate Change Thread

Post by sweetandsour » Mon Oct 08, 2018 12:36 pm

The latest report trending this morning says we have 12 years to go before all hell breaks loose.

https://amp-cnn-com.cdn.ampproject.org/ ... index.html
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Re: The Climate Change Thread

Post by FredS » Mon Oct 08, 2018 12:41 pm

Goose55 wrote:
Wed Sep 12, 2018 2:02 pm
The fact that Florence is the largest hurricane to make landfall so far north is due to historic warm ocean temperatures. Why has the ocean become so warm? Just a fluke of nature?
pssst. . .the ocean has been warming since the last ice age. Well before Jim Van Halen started peeing in it.
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Re: The Climate Change Thread

Post by sweetandsour » Mon Oct 08, 2018 12:56 pm

FredS wrote:
Mon Oct 08, 2018 12:41 pm
Goose55 wrote:
Wed Sep 12, 2018 2:02 pm
The fact that Florence is the largest hurricane to make landfall so far north is due to historic warm ocean temperatures. Why has the ocean become so warm? Just a fluke of nature?
pssst. . .the ocean has been warming since the last ice age. Well before Jim Van Halen started peeing in it.
Yeah but there's reportedly fewer fish peeing in it, so it should balance out. Not to mention whales and polar bears.
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Re: The Climate Change Thread

Post by durangopipe » Tue Oct 16, 2018 4:17 pm

. . . be kind to one another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God in Christ forgave you. Ephesians 4:32 (NKJV)

The most improper job of any man, even saints, is bossing other men. Not one in a million is fit for it, and least of all those who seek the opportunity.. J.R.R. Tolkien

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Re: The Climate Change Thread

Post by gaining_age » Tue Oct 16, 2018 4:54 pm

durangopipe wrote:
Tue Oct 16, 2018 4:17 pm
Now it’s getting serious.

https://weather.com/science/environment ... ate-change
First chocolate and now beer? Hmmmm... this is getting serious.
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Re: The Climate Change Thread

Post by tuttle » Wed Oct 17, 2018 8:25 am

gaining_age wrote:
Tue Oct 16, 2018 4:54 pm
durangopipe wrote:
Tue Oct 16, 2018 4:17 pm
Now it’s getting serious.

https://weather.com/science/environment ... ate-change
First chocolate and now beer? Hmmmm... this is getting serious.
More scare mongering. They show their hand right at the beginning:
As if last week's major study from the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) describing the potentially devastating impacts of climate change without an unprecedented global effort didn't hit home with you, maybe this will: Climate change is coming for our beer, and hard.
"Since you ignorant, anti-science rubes don't take our Intergovernmental Panel seriously, well I guess we're going to have to get a rise out of you somehow...This week beer is going to be hit hard. Next week it'll be your sex life."

As if all the draconic regulations these dolts have wet dreams about wouldn't raise the cost of virtually everything including beer.
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