I'm Starting to Like This Pope

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Re: I'm Starting to Like This Pope

Post by wosbald » Tue Jan 01, 2019 12:37 pm

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Intra-Thread Trackback: pg 83 / pg 83 / pg 84


AP Exclusive: Vatican letter undermines US cardinal on abuse [In-Depth]
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Pope Francis leaves after celebrating a new year Mass in St. Peter's Basilica at the Vatican, Tuesday, Jan. 1, 2019. Francis celebrated Mass Tuesday in St. Peter's Basilica to formally open 2019. In his homily Francis urged Catholics to allow themselves to be led again as children are led by their mothers. (AP Photo/Andrew Medichini)

VATICAN CITY (AP) — The Vatican blocked U.S. bishops from taking measures to address the clergy sex abuse scandal because U.S. church leaders didn’t discuss the legally problematic proposals with the Holy See enough beforehand, according to a letter obtained by The Associated Press.

The Nov. 11 letter from the Vatican’s Cardinal Marc Ouellet provides the primary reason that Rome balked at the measures that were to be voted on by the U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops at its Nov. 12-14 assembly. The blocked vote stunned abuse survivors and other Catholics who were demanding action from U.S. bishops to address clergy sex abuse and cover-up.

Ouellet’s letter undermines the version of events provided by the conference president, Cardinal Daniel DiNardo. It could also provide fodder for questions this week during a spiritual retreat of U.S. bishops, dedicated to the abuse crisis, that opens Wednesday in Chicago.

They may want to know why the draft proposals from the U.S. only arrived at the Vatican on Nov. 8, four days before the U.S. bishops’ meeting began. While the Vatican is known for its slow pace, even the speediest bureaucracy would have found it difficult to review and approve sensitive legal documents over a long weekend.

“Considering the nature and scope of the documents being proposed by the (conference), I believe it would have been beneficial to have allowed for more time to consult with this and other congregations with competence over the ministry and discipline of bishops,” Ouellet wrote to DiNardo. Such back-and-forth, he wrote, would have allowed the documents to “properly mature.”

The main goal of the U.S. bishops’ fall meeting had been to approve a code of conduct for bishops and create a lay-led commission to receive complaints against them. The measures were a crisis response to the scandal over ex-Cardinal Theodore McCarrick, once a senior American cleric who is now accused of molesting minors and adults, and new revelations of old sex abuse cases and their cover-up in Pennsylvania.

DiNardo stunned the bishops when he opened the assembly Nov. 12 by announcing that “at the insistence of the Holy See” the bishops would not be voting on the measures after all. He said the Vatican wanted them to delay a vote until after Francis hosts a global summit in February on preventing sex abuse by priests.

While DiNardo blamed the Vatican, the letter from Ouellet suggests that the Vatican felt that DiNardo had tried to pull a fast one by intentionally withholding legally problematic texts until the last minute. That the Vatican would have wanted a say in crafting the texts is not surprising, given the Holy See alone has exclusive authority to investigate and discipline problem bishops.

“While fully aware that a bishops’ conference enjoys a rightful autonomy ... to discuss and eventually approve measures that are within the conference’s powers, the conference’s work must always be integrated within the hierarchical structure and universal law of the church,” Ouellet wrote.

In a statement Tuesday to The Associated Press, DiNardo characterized the disconnect as a misunderstanding. He said he assumed the Vatican would have had a chance to “review and offer adjustments” to the measures after the U.S. bishops approved them, not before. He insisted that U.S. bishops were not trying to appropriate Vatican powers for themselves.

[…]

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"[T]he emergency of irregular migration has to be met with justice, solidarity and mercy. Forms of collective expulsion, which do not allow for the suitable treatment of individual cases, are unacceptable."
— Pope Francis, Morocco

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Re: I'm Starting to Like This Pope

Post by wosbald » Tue Jan 08, 2019 12:25 am

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Pope warns about fragility of international order in annual address to diplomats [In-Depth]
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Pope Francis leads an annual meeting to exchange greetings for the new year with diplomats accredited to the Holy See, at the Vatican Jan. 7. (CNS photo/Ettore Ferrari, pool via Reuters)

Vatican City — Pope Francis issued a stark warning about the fragility of the international order Jan. 7, saying in an annual address to the Vatican's diplomatic corps that "the same attitudes" that led to the failure of the League of Nations now endanger the system of diplomacy set up after World War II.

The pontiff told the some 180 ambassadors accredited to the Holy See that the success of the diplomatic order rests on three foundations: good will among nations, their ability to deal fairly with one another, and openness to compromise.

"Whenever even one of these elements is missing, the result is a search for unilateral solutions and, in the end, the domination of the powerful over the weak," said the pope.

"The League of Nations failed for these very reasons, and one notes with regret that the same attitudes are presently threatening the stability of the major international organizations," he warned, before adding: "It is clear … that relationships within the international community, and the multilateral system as a whole, are experiencing a period of difficulty."

Francis was speaking Jan. 7 in an annual event in which he gives what is often called his "State of the World" address.

[…]

Among the issues the pontiff identified: "nationalistic tendencies," "policies determined more by the search for a quick partisan consensus than by the patient pursuit of the common good," and "a gradual marginalization of the most vulnerable members of the family of nations."

Francis likewise criticized a kind of globalization that he said had "developed in too rapid and disorderly a manner, resulting in a tension between global and local realities."

"The global dimension has to be considered without ever losing sight of the local," said the pontiff. "As a reaction to a 'spherical' notion of globalization, one that levels differences and smoothes out particularities, it is easy for forms of nationalism to reemerge."

"Yet globalization can prove promising to the extent that it can be 'polyhedric,' favoring a positive interplay between the identity of individual peoples and countries and globalization itself, in accordance with the principle that the whole is greater than the part," he said.

Returning to his warning, the pontiff said that some of the issues he was highlighting "go back to the period between the two World Wars, when populist and nationalist demands proved more forceful than the activity of the League of Nations."

"The reappearance of these impulses today is progressively weakening the multilateral system, resulting in a general lack of trust, a crisis of credibility in international political life, and a gradual marginalization of the most vulnerable members of the family of nations," the pope reiterated.

After warning about the overall shape of the international order, Francis spoke to the ambassadors about four "points of contact" he sees between the work of multilateral diplomacy and the Vatican's spiritual mission: the primacy of justice and law, defense of the vulnerable, working to build bridges, and "rethinking our common destiny."

Francis began his reflection on each point by citing from Pope Paul VI's 1965 address to the United Nations, which was the first such speech given by a pontiff.

[…]

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"[T]he emergency of irregular migration has to be met with justice, solidarity and mercy. Forms of collective expulsion, which do not allow for the suitable treatment of individual cases, are unacceptable."
— Pope Francis, Morocco

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Re: I'm Starting to Like This Pope

Post by UncleBob » Tue Jan 08, 2019 9:20 am

Pope: Vatican meeting aims to 'shed full light' on sex abuse
Pope Francis says next month's meeting of bishops from around the world aims to "shed full light" on clergy sex abuse and covers-ups.

Speaking to diplomats Monday at the Vatican, Francis called the abuse of minors "one of the vilest and most heinous crimes conceivable." He said the church was working to combat and prevent abuse and its concealment, to uncover church hierarchy's involvement and to deliver justice to minors who have "suffered sexual violence aggravated by the abuse of power and conscience."
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Re: I'm Starting to Like This Pope

Post by wosbald » Tue Jan 15, 2019 4:35 pm

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Pope says recovering humanity a remedy to global indifference [In-Depth]
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Archbishop Vincenzo Paglia, President of the Pontifical Academy for Life. (Credit: Fotos Presidencia El Salvador [CC0], via Wikimedia Commons)

ROME — Pope Francis in a letter to his top body on life issues said the world must recover its sense of humanity in the face of global challenges such as war, conflict and a loss of human dignity and rights, proposing the use of new technologies as a means of developing a response aimed at the common good.

The letter, titled Humana Communitas, or “The Human Community,” was published Jan. 15 and marks the 25th anniversary of the foundation of the Pontifical Academy for Life, which was launched by St. John Paul II in 1994 and is currently headed by Archbishop Vincenzo Paglia.

It was presented to journalists the same day along with the theme of the academy’s coming Feb. 25-27 general assembly, which will focus on “Robotics: People, machines and health.”

In the letter, Francis said the human family was “God’s dream even from before the creation of the world,” and spoke of the need to overcome indifference with fraternity, while promoting the good of the human person through advances in new technologies, while also being aware of the risks.

He reaffirmed Church teaching of marriage between a man and a woman, saying the relationship between a man and a woman “is the primary place where all creation speaks with God and bears witness to his love.”

Francis also told the academy to continue promoting life at every stage, saying that in a world scarred by war and conflict, their task is to “welcome and defend human life.”

Pointing to John Paul II’s defense of the unborn, his opposition to the death penalty and his concern for the quality of human life, Francis said the academy’s work from its inception has been “to promote and protect human life at every stage of its development,” and he urged the body to reaffirm its condemnation of abortion and euthanasia “as extremely grave evils that contradict the Spirit of life and plunge us into the anti-culture of death.”

[…]

“The ever-quickening pace of technological and scientific innovation, and the phenomenon of globalization have multiplied interactions between cultures, religions and different fields of study, and among the many dimensions of our human family and the earth, our common home,” the pope said in his letter, adding that the emphasis on a new humanism is a remedy for current obstacles the human family faces.

Among these obstacles, he said, is the fact that at the moment, the quality of family relationships and social coexistence “appear seriously diminished. Mutual distrust between individuals and peoples is being fed by an inordinate pursuit of self-interest and intense competition that can even turn violent.”

Prosperity is being placed over wellbeing, and sensitivity to tragedies caused by war and violence is diminishing, he said, noting that there is an “anti-culture” of indifference growing in the global community which is “hostile to men and women and in league with the arrogance of wealth.”

“How could it happen that, at the very moment of history when available economic and technological resources make it possible for us to care suitably for our common home and our human family, in obedience to God’s command, those same economic and technological resources are creating our most bitter divisions and our worst nightmares?” he asked, adding that people are increasingly aware of “the spiritual dejection, or even nihilism, that subordinates life itself to a world and a society dominated by this paradox.”

[…]

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"[T]he emergency of irregular migration has to be met with justice, solidarity and mercy. Forms of collective expulsion, which do not allow for the suitable treatment of individual cases, are unacceptable."
— Pope Francis, Morocco

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Re: I'm Starting to Like This Pope

Post by wosbald » Wed Jan 16, 2019 9:31 am

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Intra-Thread Trackbacks: pg 79 / pg 79 / pg 79 / pg 79


German prelate says papal enemies want ‘a new conclave’
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Cardinal Walter Kasper, former president of the Pontifical Council for Promoting Christian Unity, leaves a session of the Synod of Bishops on the family at the Vatican in this Oct. 6, 2015, file photo. (Credit: Paul Haring/CNS)

ROME — A German prelate widely considered to be one of Pope Francis’s closest allies has said the current clerical abuse crisis is being used by papal opponents as a platform to expel Francis from the papacy and to elect a new pontiff that suits their agenda.

“There are people who simply don’t like this pontificate. They want it to end as soon as possible to then have, so to say, a new conclave. They also want it to go in their favor, so to it will have a result that suits their ideas,” said German Cardinal Walter Kasper in a new interview.

Kasper, president emeritus of the Pontifical Council for Promoting Christian Unity, spoke of Pope Francis and the current clerical sexual abuse crisis in a recent edition of the “Report München” program, broadcast by German state broadcaster ARD.

In the episode, which also features interviews with American Cardinal Raymond Burke and Irish abuse survivor Marie Collins, Kasper argued that there are some camps in the Church that are taking advantage of the abuse crisis as a platform for expelling Francis from the papacy.

[…]

In his comments on ARD, Kasper said papal opponents are using an “inappropriate” strategy of turning the discussion on the abuse issue “into a discussion about Pope Francis,” which he said amounts to “an abuse of abuse.”

“This diverts attention from the real problem, and this is the bad part of it,” Kapser said, adding that to turn the discussion into one on the Francis pontificate “is distracting us” from focusing on more important matters, such as developing better “means of prevention” when it comes to protecting minors from abuse.

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"[T]he emergency of irregular migration has to be met with justice, solidarity and mercy. Forms of collective expulsion, which do not allow for the suitable treatment of individual cases, are unacceptable."
— Pope Francis, Morocco

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Re: I'm Starting to Like This Pope

Post by wosbald » Thu Jan 17, 2019 8:19 am

+JMJ+

Catholics must continue seeking pardon for anti-Judaism, pope says
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Rabbi Abraham Skorka of Buenos Aires and Pope Francis embrace after visiting the Western Wall in Jerusalem May 26, 2014. The pope has written the introduction to "The Bible of Friendship," an Italian book of Christian and Jewish commentaries on the first five books of the Bible. Rabbi Skorka wrote one of the commentaries. (Credit: Paul Haring/CNS)

ROME - A few decades of respectful Catholic-Jewish dialogue pale in comparison to “19 centuries of Christian anti-Judaism,” Pope Francis said, so Catholics must continue to ask forgiveness and forge new bonds of respect and friendship with the Jewish community.

“We must work with greater intensity to ask pardon and repair the damage,” the pope said in an introduction to a new Italian book of Christian and Jewish commentaries on passages from the first five books of the Bible, which are known collectively as the Torah or Pentateuch.

Francis said the volume of commentaries, The Bible of Friendship, is an important tool for helping Catholics recognize the Jewish roots of their faith and for promoting concrete Catholic-Jewish cooperation in helping others.

“It is of vital importance for Christians to discover and foster knowledge of the Jewish tradition in order to understand themselves more authentically,” the pope said, and studying the Bible is an essential part of that effort.

Reading the Hebrew Scriptures together, he said, helps people discover the richness of the word of God. “The common objective will be to witness together to the love of the Father throughout the world.”

“The values, traditions and great ideas that characterize Judaism and Christianity must be placed at the service of humanity without ever forgetting the sacredness and authenticity of friendship,” he said.

“For Jews as for Christians there is no doubt that love of God and love for one’s neighbor summarize all the commandments,” he said. “Therefore, Jews and Christians must feel like brothers and sisters, united by the same God and by a rich, common spiritual patrimony on which to base and continue to build the future.”

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"[T]he emergency of irregular migration has to be met with justice, solidarity and mercy. Forms of collective expulsion, which do not allow for the suitable treatment of individual cases, are unacceptable."
— Pope Francis, Morocco

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Re: I'm Starting to Like This Pope

Post by wosbald » Mon Jan 28, 2019 6:57 pm

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Real Catholic media don’t look for heretics everywhere, official says
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Pope Francis greets Italian journalist Andrea Tornielli aboard his flight from Rome to Quito, Ecuador, in this July 5, 2015, file photo. (Credit: Paul Haring/CNS)

ROME — The rise of media that call themselves Catholic but seem to exist only to judge others is less about criticizing Pope Francis and more about the misguided notion that to affirm one’s own orthodoxy, one must find someone to label a heretic, said a Vatican communications official.

Andrea Tornielli, the new editorial director of the Dicastery for Communication, was commenting on Pope Francis’ remarks Jan. 24 to the bishops of Central America about Catholics losing compassion.

The pope’s meeting in Panama took place on the feast of St. Francis de Sales, patron saint of journalists, Tornielli noted.

[…]

Tornielli, writing for Vatican News, said the picture painted by the pope “unfortunately is a reality in front of everyone’s eyes: even among media that proclaim themselves Catholic, there is the spreading habit of wanting to judge everything and everyone, putting themselves on a pedestal and getting worked up especially over brothers and sisters in the faith who have different opinions.”

“One must not think this profoundly anti-Christian attitude — even if carried by ‘Catholic’ media — is a transitory phenomenon tied only to the daily criticism of the current pontiff,” Tornielli wrote.

The posture of such Catholics, he said, has less to do with the way Pope Francis challenges their assumptions and their faith and more to do with them thinking “each day my identity requires me to pick an enemy I can pounce on, someone to attack, someone to condemn, someone to judge as a heretic.”

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"[T]he emergency of irregular migration has to be met with justice, solidarity and mercy. Forms of collective expulsion, which do not allow for the suitable treatment of individual cases, are unacceptable."
— Pope Francis, Morocco

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Re: I'm Starting to Like This Pope

Post by wosbald » Wed Jan 30, 2019 10:54 am

+JMJ+

Cardinal Farrell says Amoris Laetitia is being welcomed by Catholics and opposition is “ideological”
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Cardinal Kevin Farrell

Prefect of the Vatican’s family life office says Pope Francis’ teaching has been “overwhelmingly well received” and no correction necessary

Cardinal Kevin Farrell says Pope Francis’ family life teaching is being well received by Catholics across the world and is only opposed by those who want to go back to a Church that “never existed”. The cardinal, who is Prefect of the Dicastery for Laity, Family and Life says that Amoris Laetitia does not need to be “corrected”. It is, he stresses, very clearly rooted in the gospel and sets out how to accompany married couples and families.

“From what I see from information that is coming to us from the conferences of bishops and lay groups involved in marriage and family life in different parts of the world, it is very well received, overwhelmingly well received,” the cardinal told The Tablet.

“There are some elements in the United States, on the continent of Africa, and some here in Europe — but not very strong — where they have a vision of going back to a Church that I believe never existed. Deep down this is an ideological conflict.”

The 71-year-old Irish-American prelate disagrees with those who believe Amoris Laetitia has muddied the waters of Church teaching by opening the door for divorced and remarried Catholics to receive communion.

“It’s not just a question of going up to a priest and saying ‘can I receive communion?’ It is a process, a process that could take one year, could take two years, could take three years. It depends on the people. Fundamentally, this is about encountering people where they are,” he explains.

“You have two people who are divorced and remarried. Are they outside the Church forever? There’s no redemption whatsoever? None? You mean to tell me that Christ and Christ’s redemption didn’t work for those people? No.”

[…]

In 2016 four cardinals, two of which have since died, publicly released a series of questions — or “dubia” — to the Pope calling on him to clarify his teaching, and event threatening to correct it.

“There is no correction to be made,” the cardinal says. “There is nothing in ‘Amoris Laetitia’ that is contrary to the Gospel. What does Francis do? He goes to the gospel. Look at every chapter, its straight out of one of the gospels or the letters of St Paul.”

[…]

The cardinal says that while in recent years popes have encountered opposition, what the current Pope is facing is “unprecedented”. It is, he says, “vicious” and shows “where our culture is”. But he argues Francis has put the Church on a path from which there is no exit.

“I would say that he has put the Church on an evangelical road,” the cardinal says at the end of our discussion. “I don’t mean ‘non-Catholic’, I mean evangelical, like the Gospel.”

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"[T]he emergency of irregular migration has to be met with justice, solidarity and mercy. Forms of collective expulsion, which do not allow for the suitable treatment of individual cases, are unacceptable."
— Pope Francis, Morocco

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Re: I'm Starting to Like This Pope

Post by wosbald » Sat Feb 09, 2019 3:04 pm

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Vatican ex-doctrine chief pens manifesto amid pope criticism
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In this Oct. 25, 2016 file photo, Cardinal Gerhard Ludwig Mueller, former prefect of the Congregation of the Doctrine of the Faith, attends a press conference illustrating new Catholic guidelines on burial and cremation, at the Vatican. (Credit: AP Photo/Alessandra Tarantino, file.)

VATICAN CITY — The Vatican’s former doctrine chief has penned a “manifesto of faith” to remind Catholics of basic tenets of belief amid what he says is “growing confusion” in the Church today.

Cardinal Gerhard Mueller didn’t name Pope Francis in his four-page manifesto [see here for PDF], released late Friday. But the document was nevertheless a clear manifestation of conservative criticism of Francis’s emphasis on mercy and accompaniment versus a focus on repeating Catholic morals and doctrine during the previous two papacies.

Mueller wrote that a pastor’s failure to teach Catholic truths was the greatest deception — “It is the fraud of the anti-Christ.”

Francis sacked Mueller as prefect of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith in 2017, denying the German a second five-year term.

In the document, which was published by conservative Catholic media that have been critical of Francis, Mueller repeats basic Catholic teaching that Catholics must be free from sin before receiving Communion. He mentions divorced and remarried faithful, in a clear reference to Francis’s opening to letting these Catholics receive Communion on a case-by-case basis after a process of accompaniment and discernment with their pastors.

Mueller also repeats that women cannot be ordained priests and that priests must be celibate. Francis has reaffirmed the ban on ordination for women but has commissioned a study on women deacons in the early church. Francis has also reaffirmed priestly celibacy but has made the case for exceptions where “pastoral necessity” might justify ordaining married men of proven virtue.

“In the face of growing confusion about the doctrine of the faith, many bishops, priests, religious and lay people of the Catholic Church have requested that I make a public testimony about the truth of revelation,” Mueller wrote. “It is the shepherd’s very own task to guide those entrusted to them on the path of salvation.”

[…]

Mueller’s manifesto carries the date of Feb. 10 — the eve of the sixth anniversary of Pope Benedict XVI’s historic announcement that he would resign. Many conservatives are nostalgic for the doctrinal clarity and certainty of Benedict’s reign.

It was published after Francis penned a joint declaration of “fraternity” with a prominent Muslim imam during his recent trip to the United Arab Emirates. Some conservatives say the document’s claim that the pluralism of religions is “willed by God” muddies Catholic belief about the centrality of Christ. Francis has defended the document as doctrinally sound.

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"[T]he emergency of irregular migration has to be met with justice, solidarity and mercy. Forms of collective expulsion, which do not allow for the suitable treatment of individual cases, are unacceptable."
— Pope Francis, Morocco

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Re: I'm Starting to Like This Pope

Post by wosbald » Sun Feb 10, 2019 3:42 pm

+JMJ+

Intra-Thread Trackback: pg 86


Cardinal Kasper says Mueller’s manifesto spreads ‘confusion and division’
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Cardinal Walter Kasper, president emeritus of the Pontifical Council for Promoting Christian Unity, at the Vatican in April 2015. (Credit: Bohumil Petrik/CNA)

Munich, Germany, Feb 10, 2019 / 01:32 pm (CNA/EWTN News) — Cardinal Walter Kasper has released a criticism of Cardinal Gerhard Müller’s “Manifesto of Faith,” accusing it of containing half-truths and blanket statements that could lead to division and confusion in the Church.

In a statement on katholisch.de, Kasper said that while the manifesto “contains many statements of faith that every upright Catholic can wholeheartedly affirm,” some of the truths in it “are pointed out so pointedly that it fades out the other half.”

On Feb. 8, Cardinal Gerhard Müller, former prefect of the Vatican’s doctrinal office, published a “Manifesto of Faith,” which he described as a response to Catholics who have requested that he issue a “public testimony about the truth of revelation” in response to “growing confusion about the doctrine of the Faith.”

[…]

Kasper, who has been an outspoken advocate of the admission of the divorced-and-remarried to Holy Communion, accused Müller of making “unacceptable blanket statements,” such as the assertion that “the conscience of the faithful is not sufficiently formed.”

“It is undoubtedly true that the confession of the Triune God constitutes a fundamental difference in belief in God and the image of man from other religions. But are there not similarities, especially with the Jews and the Muslims, in the belief in the one God? And are not these similarities today fundamental to peace in the world and in society? Half the truth is not the Catholic truth!” Kasper charged.

He also said that he was “totally horrified” to read Müller’s statement that failing to teach the truths of the Catholic faith “it is the fraud of Antichrist.”

Kasper suggested that Müller was following the path of Martin Luther: “One who rightly advocates reforms in the Church, but wants to pursue these behind the Pope’s back and enforce them in opposition to him? I would find that hard to believe. For that could only lead to confusion and division. That could unhinge the Catholic Church.”

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"[T]he emergency of irregular migration has to be met with justice, solidarity and mercy. Forms of collective expulsion, which do not allow for the suitable treatment of individual cases, are unacceptable."
— Pope Francis, Morocco

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Re: I'm Starting to Like This Pope

Post by hugodrax » Sun Feb 10, 2019 6:25 pm

https://youtu.be/uTmfwklFM-M
Notre Dame de Paris, priez pour nous y comprise les Jesuites.

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Re: I'm Starting to Like This Pope

Post by wosbald » Mon Feb 18, 2019 8:52 am

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(Part 1) A Brief Introduction to the Theology of Pope Francis
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In God’s gift of faith, a supernatural infused virtue, we realize that a great love has been offered us, a good word has been spoken to us, and that when we welcome that word, Jesus Christ the Word made flesh, the Holy Spirit transforms us, lights up our way to the future and enables us joyfully to advance along that way on wings of hope.

— Pope Francis, Lumen Fidei
It has been suggested before that Pope Francis is “not a theologian,” likely due to the stark difference in style while speaking or writing as compared to his predecessors, namely Pope Benedict XVI and St. John Paul II. While answering a question about his relationship with the Pope Emeritus, Pope Francis himself admitted that he is “not a theologian.” Perhaps what he is referring to is that he is not a “systematic theologian,” especially vis-à-vis Benedict, which appears demonstrably true.

However, when others say that Francis is “not a theologian,” they usually mean to imply a lack of academic training–in fact, he received several years of academic training–and it also implies that Francis himself is not as smart or capable, theologically speaking, as his predecessors. (See here this article in which Francis is the denied the epithet “intellectual” shortly after the author denies he is a theologian.)

But this too appears to be groundless, even if the question itself is irrelevant to the legitimacy or effectiveness of his papacy. As Elise Harris’ helpful article from the Catholic News Agency reveals, Pope Francis was not too far removed from obtaining his doctorate and, in fact, was a brilliant, well-rounded student. However, before he could complete formal academic study, he was called to serve the Church in various leadership and administrative posts.

On the basis of the above, perhaps we can say that Francis has not devoted himself primarily (certainly not exclusively) to pursuits of the mind. But, even so, we should at least admit that Pope Francis is thoughtful, well-educated, and well-read. It is likely that Francis is not winging his theology while serving as the Vicar of Christ or writing and speaking without regard to various Catholic theological traditions. Assuming, therefore, Pope Francis has actually spent some time developing his own comprehensive worldview, we can and should ask the question: where does Pope Francis stand, theologically speaking?

[…]
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(Part 2) Romano Guardini: A Brief Introduction to the Theology of Pope Francis
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While well-educated and academically trained, it can be said that Pope Francis does not belong to any one “school.” He is not strictly an “Augustinian” or a “Thomist,” though he cites Aquinas quite liberally. However, one person to whom we can likely grant a place of honor is Romano Guardini, to whom Francis devoted his doctoral studies. Guardini, of course, was one of the great thinkers of the early 20th century whose work heavily influenced the theology underlying the Second Vatican Council and many other prominent Catholic theologians.

Italian-born, Guardini grew up in Germany where he had a special role in the formation of young Pope Benedict XVI. Coincidentally, therefore, Guardini’s influence can be felt in both Pope Benedict’s and Pope Francis’ writing. Many of the contributions Francis has made to the Church are substantively in continuity with this school of thought that can be traced from Benedict and Communio through Paul VI and Vatican II to Guardini.

Three main themes from Guardini’s writings that can be found in the thought of Pope Francis are the importance of individual relationships (“I-thou”); theonomy; and the locus of faith being the Church.

[…]
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(Part 3) Argentina: A Brief Introduction to the Theology of Pope Francis
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Guardini is not the only influence on Pope Francis, of course. Pope Francis’ theology seems heavily influenced by his pastoral work in Argentina. That is to say, Pope Francis’ theology is pastoral in nature, and it is also shaped by his experiences in Argentina.

Pope Francis’ biography on the Vatican website is eager to mention that Francis is a “simple pastor.” Like St. John Paul II, he has an acute awareness of and sympathy with the difficulties of the laity trying to do their best in everyday life. St. John Paul II was able to write Love and Responsibility and the Theology of the Body, rooted as they are in a deep philosophical and theological tradition, not because he simply reasoned to it, but because he understood deeply what makes relationships work through many hours of counseling and pastoral support to engaged and married Catholics.

Similarly, Amoris Laetitia is written from the unique perspective of a pastor who has journeyed with people through seemingly impossible situations. When Francis writes, therefore, he is not writing merely to educate or elucidate, although there is plenty of that. Rather, Francis writes to guide and direct, to provide encouragement and sometimes a kick in the pants.

The most “pastoral” examples of his are, of course, Amoris Laetitia and Gaudete et Exsultate, in which in several places the Pope addresses directly to “you.” Akin to his very personal theology, Francis takes a very personal approach in his writing. He writes,
You too need to see the entirety of your life as a mission. Try to do so by listening to God in prayer and recognizing the signs that he gives you. Always ask the Spirit what Jesus expects from you at every moment of your life and in every decision you must make, so as to discern its place in the mission you have received. Allow the Spirit to forge in you the personal mystery that can reflect Jesus Christ in today’s world.
[…]
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{Part 4} Ignatius: A Brief Introduction to the Theology of Pope Francis
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Finally, we should not neglect the importance of Francis being the first Jesuit pope. In many respects, it appears Francis’ Jesuit background has had an important influence on Pope Francis’ theology. Given the Jesuits lengthy history and its varying roles over time, it would be merely superficial to draw the many parallels between Francis’ papacy and the Jesuit order broadly. Rather, the goal here specifically is to focus on the parallels between Francis’ writings and an Ignatian spirituality, specifically as developed by St. Ignatius of Loyola himself.

As Father Robert Imbelli writes for America Magazine, Gaudete et Exsultate “is deeply Ignatian.” Indeed, Pope Francis cites St. Ignatius of Loyola several times in this document. Aside from those direct citations, Imbelli notes a few other clear overlaps between the writings of both.

Francis compares the spiritual life to a battle, a theme quite often used by St. Ignatius in his spiritual writings. This recurrent battle theme in St. Ignatius’ writings, of course, most likely flow from his own personal experiences as a soldier–that is, until his leg was shattered by a cannonball, prompting a deeper spirituality. Francis introduces a section entitled “Spiritual combat, vigilance and discernment” with the following:
The Christian life is a constant battle. We need strength and courage to withstand the temptations of the devil and to proclaim the Gospel. This battle is sweet, for it allows us to rejoice each time the Lord triumphs in our lives.
[…]

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Re: I'm Starting to Like This Pope

Post by hugodrax » Mon Feb 18, 2019 9:04 am

That website you quoted is interestingly one-sided, set up to praise Pope Francis in all things. It's like going to LifeSite or Church Militant and expecting to hear charity towards the USSCB, or reading America looking for a heterosexual point of view.

The reading is interesting, but I question why this Pope requires such dedicated PR.
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Re: I'm Starting to Like This Pope

Post by durangopipe » Mon Feb 18, 2019 12:42 pm

hugodrax wrote:
Mon Feb 18, 2019 9:04 am
That website you quoted is interestingly one-sided, set up to praise Pope Francis in all things. It's like going to LifeSite or Church Militant and expecting to hear charity towards the USSCB, or reading America looking for a heterosexual point of view.

The reading is interesting, but I question why this Pope requires such dedicated PR.

A small sample of recent headlines:
German prelate says papal enemies want ‘a new conclave’
Crux Staff
The war against Pope Francis
His modesty and humility have made him a popular figure around the world. But inside the church, his reforms have infuriated conservatives and sparked a revolt
Pope Francis, Cornered Between Vatican Conservatives And Trump Allies
The Argentine pontiff, used to navigating politics in Buenos Aires, is battling at a whole different level now. And his papacy may hang in the balance.
Vatican Power Struggle Bursts Into Open as Conservatives Pounce
Vatican whistle-blower renews attacks on Pope Francis over disgraced cardinal as crisis in Catholic Church deepens
The civil war in the Catholic Church
Conservative priests are using outrage over sexual abuse to try to force Pope Francis to resign
That was a rhetorical question, right?
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Re: I'm Starting to Like This Pope

Post by Hovannes » Mon Feb 18, 2019 1:44 pm

durangopipe wrote:
Mon Feb 18, 2019 12:42 pm
hugodrax wrote:
Mon Feb 18, 2019 9:04 am
That website you quoted is interestingly one-sided, set up to praise Pope Francis in all things. It's like going to LifeSite or Church Militant and expecting to hear charity towards the USSCB, or reading America looking for a heterosexual point of view.

The reading is interesting, but I question why this Pope requires such dedicated PR.

A small sample of recent headlines:
German prelate says papal enemies want ‘a new conclave’
Crux Staff
The war against Pope Francis
His modesty and humility have made him a popular figure around the world. But inside the church, his reforms have infuriated conservatives and sparked a revolt
Pope Francis, Cornered Between Vatican Conservatives And Trump Allies
The Argentine pontiff, used to navigating politics in Buenos Aires, is battling at a whole different level now. And his papacy may hang in the balance.
Vatican Power Struggle Bursts Into Open as Conservatives Pounce
Vatican whistle-blower renews attacks on Pope Francis over disgraced cardinal as crisis in Catholic Church deepens
The civil war in the Catholic Church
Conservative priests are using outrage over sexual abuse to try to force Pope Francis to resign
That was a rhetorical question, right?
All Francis needs to do is clarify his statements and rectify them with the Catechism.
Until he elects to do so many Catholics will probably disregard any PR as conjecture and Francis' tenure as kind of bizarre footnote in Church History, much like several other Popes during the past 2,000 years. And like those popes, he's not going anywhere as much as some may wish
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Re: I'm Starting to Like This Pope

Post by hugodrax » Mon Feb 18, 2019 2:15 pm

durangopipe wrote:
Mon Feb 18, 2019 12:42 pm
hugodrax wrote:
Mon Feb 18, 2019 9:04 am
That website you quoted is interestingly one-sided, set up to praise Pope Francis in all things. It's like going to LifeSite or Church Militant and expecting to hear charity towards the USSCB, or reading America looking for a heterosexual point of view.

The reading is interesting, but I question why this Pope requires such dedicated PR.

A small sample of recent headlines:
German prelate says papal enemies want ‘a new conclave’
Crux Staff
The war against Pope Francis
His modesty and humility have made him a popular figure around the world. But inside the church, his reforms have infuriated conservatives and sparked a revolt
Pope Francis, Cornered Between Vatican Conservatives And Trump Allies
The Argentine pontiff, used to navigating politics in Buenos Aires, is battling at a whole different level now. And his papacy may hang in the balance.
Vatican Power Struggle Bursts Into Open as Conservatives Pounce
Vatican whistle-blower renews attacks on Pope Francis over disgraced cardinal as crisis in Catholic Church deepens
The civil war in the Catholic Church
Conservative priests are using outrage over sexual abuse to try to force Pope Francis to resign
That was a rhetorical question, right?
Yes, but not in the way you took it. I maintain that Pope Francis is pushing a theory of papal power so new that his pr team was put together as a preemptive strike force. A giant gaslighting operation, if you will.

There is a manufacturing of narrative here on an unprecedented scale.

From what I see, and admittedly its personal opinion and I can be quite wrong, the real struggle in the church right now is a question of the role the papacy itself plays, with a radically new theory requiring the creation of fake news.

T here is a notion going around, and a very modern one, that the Pope is the living embodiment of the Holy Spirit, that the "Church is openly ruled by an individual rather than by Scripture alone or even its own dictates of tradition plus Scripture[.]" and that Francis "breaks Catholic traditions whenever he wants because he is free from disordered attachments." (Father Rosica tweeting right before the death penalty was made unacceptable by new catechism).

The idea takes the slightest personal utterance of the pope as binding doctrinally on Catholics. This is supercalifragilisticexponentialultramontanism.

There is a cadre of real papal meanies out there espousing this theory, by which I mean the likes of Faggioli, Fr. Rosica, Ivereigh, and a former piano-tuner whose name escapes me at the moment, who seem to make their living by bashing publicly anyone that disagrees, no matter how slightly or deferentially, with Pope Francis.

Then, we also have those of both left-leaning and right-leaning worldly politics who are trying to remake the Church into a tool of their political beliefs (never forget Clinton, Podesta, and the push for the "Catholic Spring"--the right is just as bad) and using the media to do it.

What we are seeing in our media is classic Democrat-Republican jockeying. What we are seeing in the Church is a vicious power grab. It's like watching the Borgias and the Colonnas tweeting.

And, as Hov says, it's all just a blip on the historical screen, over before you know it, and only as important as we choose to make it.
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Re: I'm Starting to Like This Pope

Post by UncleBob » Mon Feb 18, 2019 3:31 pm

hugodrax wrote:
Mon Feb 18, 2019 2:15 pm
Yes, but not in the way you took it. I maintain that Pope Francis is pushing a theory of papal power so new that his pr team was put together as a preemptive strike force. A giant gaslighting operation, if you will.

There is a manufacturing of narrative here on an unprecedented scale.

From what I see, and admittedly its personal opinion and I can be quite wrong, the real struggle in the church right now is a question of the role the papacy itself plays, with a radically new theory requiring the creation of fake news.

T here is a notion going around, and a very modern one, that the Pope is the living embodiment of the Holy Spirit, that the "Church is openly ruled by an individual rather than by Scripture alone or even its own dictates of tradition plus Scripture[.]" and that Francis "breaks Catholic traditions whenever he wants because he is free from disordered attachments." (Father Rosica tweeting right before the death penalty was made unacceptable by new catechism).

The idea takes the slightest personal utterance of the pope as binding doctrinally on Catholics. This is supercalifragilisticexponentialultramontanism.

There is a cadre of real papal meanies out there espousing this theory, by which I mean the likes of Faggioli, Fr. Rosica, Ivereigh, and a former piano-tuner whose name escapes me at the moment, who seem to make their living by bashing publicly anyone that disagrees, no matter how slightly or deferentially, with Pope Francis.

Then, we also have those of both left-leaning and right-leaning worldly politics who are trying to remake the Church into a tool of their political beliefs (never forget Clinton, Podesta, and the push for the "Catholic Spring"--the right is just as bad) and using the media to do it.

What we are seeing in our media is classic Democrat-Republican jockeying. What we are seeing in the Church is a vicious power grab. It's like watching the Borgias and the Colonnas tweeting.

And, as Hov says, it's all just a blip on the historical screen, over before you know it, and only as important as we choose to make it.
That's interesting.

My belief (as an outsider looking in) is that Frank seems to be attempting something daring in today's environment: He seems to be trying to wrestle power away from the extreme poles. In general, centrists in most all political and religious organizations are ignored because of various reasons--not the least of which is often a tacit apathy--but he seems to be trying to force some action in the middle. If this is the case, then good on him, IMO.
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Re: I'm Starting to Like This Pope

Post by hugodrax » Mon Feb 18, 2019 5:08 pm

UncleBob wrote:
Mon Feb 18, 2019 3:31 pm
hugodrax wrote:
Mon Feb 18, 2019 2:15 pm
Yes, but not in the way you took it. I maintain that Pope Francis is pushing a theory of papal power so new that his pr team was put together as a preemptive strike force. A giant gaslighting operation, if you will.

There is a manufacturing of narrative here on an unprecedented scale.

From what I see, and admittedly its personal opinion and I can be quite wrong, the real struggle in the church right now is a question of the role the papacy itself plays, with a radically new theory requiring the creation of fake news.

T here is a notion going around, and a very modern one, that the Pope is the living embodiment of the Holy Spirit, that the "Church is openly ruled by an individual rather than by Scripture alone or even its own dictates of tradition plus Scripture[.]" and that Francis "breaks Catholic traditions whenever he wants because he is free from disordered attachments." (Father Rosica tweeting right before the death penalty was made unacceptable by new catechism).

The idea takes the slightest personal utterance of the pope as binding doctrinally on Catholics. This is supercalifragilisticexponentialultramontanism.

There is a cadre of real papal meanies out there espousing this theory, by which I mean the likes of Faggioli, Fr. Rosica, Ivereigh, and a former piano-tuner whose name escapes me at the moment, who seem to make their living by bashing publicly anyone that disagrees, no matter how slightly or deferentially, with Pope Francis.

Then, we also have those of both left-leaning and right-leaning worldly politics who are trying to remake the Church into a tool of their political beliefs (never forget Clinton, Podesta, and the push for the "Catholic Spring"--the right is just as bad) and using the media to do it.

What we are seeing in our media is classic Democrat-Republican jockeying. What we are seeing in the Church is a vicious power grab. It's like watching the Borgias and the Colonnas tweeting.

And, as Hov says, it's all just a blip on the historical screen, over before you know it, and only as important as we choose to make it.
That's interesting.

My belief (as an outsider looking in) is that Frank seems to be attempting something daring in today's environment: He seems to be trying to wrestle power away from the extreme poles. In general, centrists in most all political and religious organizations are ignored because of various reasons--not the least of which is often a tacit apathy--but he seems to be trying to force some action in the middle. If this is the case, then good on him, IMO.
I have a theory that every man sees himself as an imminently reasonable centrist, but give him some power and watch him build the camps. All those freaks out there, goofing up the world...if you just gave me all the power, life would be so reasonable.

For instance, you think of yourself as a centrist, right, Bob? I think of you as slightly to the left politically because you're to the left of me and I'm a centrist. :D

Religiously, though...not to put too fine a point on it, but I consider you to hold views that would shock one of those lesbian nuns working for universal abortion and women's ordination. The fact you think of Pope Francis as a centrist scares the crud out of me. :D
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Re: I'm Starting to Like This Pope

Post by UncleBob » Mon Feb 18, 2019 9:10 pm

hugodrax wrote:
Mon Feb 18, 2019 5:08 pm
UncleBob wrote:
Mon Feb 18, 2019 3:31 pm
hugodrax wrote:
Mon Feb 18, 2019 2:15 pm
Yes, but not in the way you took it. I maintain that Pope Francis is pushing a theory of papal power so new that his pr team was put together as a preemptive strike force. A giant gaslighting operation, if you will.

There is a manufacturing of narrative here on an unprecedented scale.

From what I see, and admittedly its personal opinion and I can be quite wrong, the real struggle in the church right now is a question of the role the papacy itself plays, with a radically new theory requiring the creation of fake news.

T here is a notion going around, and a very modern one, that the Pope is the living embodiment of the Holy Spirit, that the "Church is openly ruled by an individual rather than by Scripture alone or even its own dictates of tradition plus Scripture[.]" and that Francis "breaks Catholic traditions whenever he wants because he is free from disordered attachments." (Father Rosica tweeting right before the death penalty was made unacceptable by new catechism).

The idea takes the slightest personal utterance of the pope as binding doctrinally on Catholics. This is supercalifragilisticexponentialultramontanism.

There is a cadre of real papal meanies out there espousing this theory, by which I mean the likes of Faggioli, Fr. Rosica, Ivereigh, and a former piano-tuner whose name escapes me at the moment, who seem to make their living by bashing publicly anyone that disagrees, no matter how slightly or deferentially, with Pope Francis.

Then, we also have those of both left-leaning and right-leaning worldly politics who are trying to remake the Church into a tool of their political beliefs (never forget Clinton, Podesta, and the push for the "Catholic Spring"--the right is just as bad) and using the media to do it.

What we are seeing in our media is classic Democrat-Republican jockeying. What we are seeing in the Church is a vicious power grab. It's like watching the Borgias and the Colonnas tweeting.

And, as Hov says, it's all just a blip on the historical screen, over before you know it, and only as important as we choose to make it.
That's interesting.

My belief (as an outsider looking in) is that Frank seems to be attempting something daring in today's environment: He seems to be trying to wrestle power away from the extreme poles. In general, centrists in most all political and religious organizations are ignored because of various reasons--not the least of which is often a tacit apathy--but he seems to be trying to force some action in the middle. If this is the case, then good on him, IMO.
I have a theory that every man sees himself as an imminently reasonable centrist, but give him some power and watch him build the camps. All those freaks out there, goofing up the world...if you just gave me all the power, life would be so reasonable.

For instance, you think of yourself as a centrist, right, Bob? I think of you as slightly to the left politically because you're to the left of me and I'm a centrist. :D

Religiously, though...not to put too fine a point on it, but I consider you to hold views that would shock one of those lesbian nuns working for universal abortion and women's ordination. The fact you think of Pope Francis as a centrist scares the crud out of me. :D
Oh, I have no idea if Frank is a centrist, I just think he is trying to shake off the apathy of the centrists. He cheeses off the dust-farters and the rainbow-farters. They fight; they unleash the umbrage; and in order to avoid another schism, the middle--both laic and cleric--has to get off the pew and get involved. It's just a possibility.
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Re: I'm Starting to Like This Pope

Post by hugodrax » Mon Feb 18, 2019 10:03 pm

UncleBob wrote:
Mon Feb 18, 2019 9:10 pm
hugodrax wrote:
Mon Feb 18, 2019 5:08 pm
UncleBob wrote:
Mon Feb 18, 2019 3:31 pm
hugodrax wrote:
Mon Feb 18, 2019 2:15 pm
Yes, but not in the way you took it. I maintain that Pope Francis is pushing a theory of papal power so new that his pr team was put together as a preemptive strike force. A giant gaslighting operation, if you will.

There is a manufacturing of narrative here on an unprecedented scale.

From what I see, and admittedly its personal opinion and I can be quite wrong, the real struggle in the church right now is a question of the role the papacy itself plays, with a radically new theory requiring the creation of fake news.

T here is a notion going around, and a very modern one, that the Pope is the living embodiment of the Holy Spirit, that the "Church is openly ruled by an individual rather than by Scripture alone or even its own dictates of tradition plus Scripture[.]" and that Francis "breaks Catholic traditions whenever he wants because he is free from disordered attachments." (Father Rosica tweeting right before the death penalty was made unacceptable by new catechism).

The idea takes the slightest personal utterance of the pope as binding doctrinally on Catholics. This is supercalifragilisticexponentialultramontanism.

There is a cadre of real papal meanies out there espousing this theory, by which I mean the likes of Faggioli, Fr. Rosica, Ivereigh, and a former piano-tuner whose name escapes me at the moment, who seem to make their living by bashing publicly anyone that disagrees, no matter how slightly or deferentially, with Pope Francis.

Then, we also have those of both left-leaning and right-leaning worldly politics who are trying to remake the Church into a tool of their political beliefs (never forget Clinton, Podesta, and the push for the "Catholic Spring"--the right is just as bad) and using the media to do it.

What we are seeing in our media is classic Democrat-Republican jockeying. What we are seeing in the Church is a vicious power grab. It's like watching the Borgias and the Colonnas tweeting.

And, as Hov says, it's all just a blip on the historical screen, over before you know it, and only as important as we choose to make it.
That's interesting.

My belief (as an outsider looking in) is that Frank seems to be attempting something daring in today's environment: He seems to be trying to wrestle power away from the extreme poles. In general, centrists in most all political and religious organizations are ignored because of various reasons--not the least of which is often a tacit apathy--but he seems to be trying to force some action in the middle. If this is the case, then good on him, IMO.
I have a theory that every man sees himself as an imminently reasonable centrist, but give him some power and watch him build the camps. All those freaks out there, goofing up the world...if you just gave me all the power, life would be so reasonable.

For instance, you think of yourself as a centrist, right, Bob? I think of you as slightly to the left politically because you're to the left of me and I'm a centrist. :D

Religiously, though...not to put too fine a point on it, but I consider you to hold views that would shock one of those lesbian nuns working for universal abortion and women's ordination. The fact you think of Pope Francis as a centrist scares the crud out of me. :D
Oh, I have no idea if Frank is a centrist, I just think he is trying to shake off the apathy of the centrists. He cheeses off the dust-farters and the rainbow-farters. They fight; they unleash the umbrage; and in order to avoid another schism, the middle--both laic and cleric--has to get off the pew and get involved. It's just a possibility.
Might could be. Nice, sane way of looking at it.
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