Will you take a Covid 19 vaccine?

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tuttle
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Re: Will you take a Covid 19 vaccine?

Post by tuttle » Tue Dec 22, 2020 10:44 am

FredS wrote:
Mon Dec 21, 2020 5:10 pm
tuttle wrote:
Mon Dec 21, 2020 11:30 am
FredS wrote:
Mon Dec 21, 2020 11:06 am
AnungUnRama wrote:
Mon Dec 21, 2020 10:41 am
tuttle wrote:
Mon Dec 21, 2020 9:59 am
I'm against forced vaccines for COVID-19 and any steps leading to that destination.
^^^^^^^This. Emphatically, absolutely, without question THIS.
Because you're going to live in your own cave the rest of your life?

We (your fellow citizens) have mandated and forced hundreds of impositions on your freedom for our good rather than yours. Your employers have done the same in the name of protecting their company as well as your coworkers and customers. I have not heard of any governmental agency forcing these new vaccines on anyone but if covid and other novel virus' continue to be a problem over the coming years, and if a vaccine is proven safe and effective over the next couple years, we may very well decide it's in our interest to require you and your children to be vaccinated if you wish to move about outside your home.
All that is to be seen. I haven't heard of any agencies forcing anyone to take the vaccine but I have heard a lot of people signal such a thing should happen, or at the very least make arguments that it'll never happen and when it does I guess you'll go live in a cave...

If a town contracts the bubonic plague and half of them die and the other half are looking all swelly in the pits then it behooves the government to step in, lock it down, vax the lot of them, even against their will. That's a proper use of emergency powers. When there is an actual, you know, emergency. The problem with COVID is that it isn't the bubonic plague but it's being treated as such.

I have no reason to believe the flu vaccine is either ineffective (for whatever particular strain it's combating) or unsafe. But I don't take it because it's not the bubonic plague and I'm not likely going to drop dead in the street from the flu. Maybe I'll change my tune when I'm up in years and the likelihood of me keeling over from the flu is higher. I have nothing against it.

Same with Covid. For right now I see no reason for me or mine to take it. If contracted, the likelihood of death is less than 1%. More people would know that information if our overlords wouldn't censor it at every turn. More people might take those real scientific numbers seriously if every political and cultural influencer didn't mock and deride people who discuss it as Anti-science and Covid-deniers.

All that aside, when I'm an old man and my likelihood of death from Covid (as opposed to death, ahem, with Covid) increases a few percentage points, I'll be happy to consider such a safe and healthy vaccine, especially after it's been out there for 20-30 years instead of 2 weeks. All the more reason to feel good about it.

But removing people's freedom to move, assemble, travel, buy/sell, or any other thing because they don't have their COVID ID Card stamped APPROVED? Well, percentages of people dying COVID associated deaths might go up.
We're largely in agreement here but for two things:
- Are you calling me a geezer? You mentioned old people and how the vaccine may be more appropriate for them twice in your reply. :twisted: :D :twisted:
I suppose I should be glad you didn't mention overweight, outta shape smokers.

- You mentioned that if "half the town" died it'd be appropriate for Uncle Joe to step in and mandate the vaccination. Would it also be proper if 49% died? How about 40%? 10%? 5%? Who gets to decide? This is where the whole thing get's muddy. Nobody trusts "the numbers" put out by the government or the media. Many - like you, Affers, Del, AnungUnRama, Slowtoke, and others - think they're inflated to present more of an urgency for the government to force lockdowns, face coverings, or mandatory vaccination. To scare us into giving up a little liberty for safety. I don't trust the numbers simply because I know how the healthcare bureaucracy runs. I don't trust them provide accurate information - especially if padding "the number" earns them more compensation, or less blame, or financial burden. I do think the nurses, docs, and even politicians individually, have our best interests at heart though.
:lol: I swear I was thinking only of myself, fatty.

I think the numbers are skewey, but not inflated to the point of outright falsehood. The bigger issue isn't inflated numbers so much as hyper-focused on numbers as a way to scare people rather to inform them. There is a reason they continue to pound the drum of cases. The number of virus cases is going viral!...shocker. It's why it's important to look at the death numbers too. I don't think this is a hoax or fake or a virus created by an evil supervillain in order to overthrow the governments of the world.

And the half the town example was trying to show a real emergency rather than focusing on the numbers of people. I've used other examples to distinguish. Like someone screaming fire in a movie theater when they saw the popcorn machine spark. Maybe a few concession stand workers got a burn or hit with some funky fumes, but there was no actual fire. Just a spark and a machine on the fritz. No one in the theater was in any real danger. To make it closer to our situation, there are many people who are running and shoving other people to motivate them to run all the while yelling at them "Can't you see that the popcorn machine sparked! You not running and screaming is not a comforting sight to others!" But sometimes I run away with analogies until I can't remember what we're talking about anymore.

I'll just boil our situation down on 'who decides' to The People. At least that's what our country does even if it currently looks at people who give that answer as if they have two heads. The people decide. Meaning if the people believe the government has abused their emergency powers, then they must not allow them to either keep those powers or abuse them again in the future. Outside of all that, what we need is a healthy scoop of Wisdom and Discernment. It's obvious we've left those two at the station which is another layer on this crapcake.

Anyhoo, I doubt I'll add much more this year. I'll be out of commission for a bit over the holidays.
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Re: Will you take a Covid 19 vaccine?

Post by TheShepherd » Tue Dec 22, 2020 10:48 am

Vaccines don't scare me, so I'd take one. (There are many other manufactured consumer products which would be higher on my list to be scared of).

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Re: Will you take a Covid 19 vaccine?

Post by Stanley76 » Tue Dec 22, 2020 11:10 am

My issue is not trusting any of the institutions I used to trust on medical issues. The W.H.O., C.D.C., my own HCPs, the news, everything seems to be contradictory on Covid. It came naturally from bat. No, it came from a lab in Wuhan, well yeah but they were experimenting on bat viruses. It was released from a wet market, no it was released accidentally from the lab, no it was released on the world as a bioweapons attack. It's no worse than the flu, it's much worse than the flu, it will kill us all, it only kills .3% of those who contract it. The Covid deaths are inflated and most of the deaths are from people with pre-existing conditions, no the Covid death numbers are accurate, no they aren't. Hydroxycholorquine cures Covid, no it will kill you, now it works again. You can catch it by touching surfaces, no you can only catch it if you breath in the virus from someone who is infected. Masks don't work, masks do work, some masks work, some masks might work. You should wear latex gloves in public, no you shouldn't. A vaccine takes years to develop and test, no it only takes six months. China wants to barcode vaccinated people or microchip them, no they don't. The vaccine is made from aborted baby stem cells, no it's not it's made from research done on aborted baby stem cells, no some of the ones they are working on now don't use stem cells. VP Pence took the vaccine, no he didn't he got shot up with distilled water. You won't be able to go in a store or travel without proof of vaccination, yes you will be able to do what ever you want vaccinated or not. If you catch it and recover you are immune, no it mutates and you'll have to get vaccinated every year just like the flu. It IS the flu (from a doctor), not it's not (from another doctor. From my own HC facility, two nurses have told me they will not take it unless forced to to keep their job. From another nurse I know, we HAVE to take it to get the country moving again.

Seriously, I have no clue of who to believe or trust. When that happens I usually step back and watch and see what happens with my own eyes. I have friends who are going to take it. I'll see what happens to them (probably nothing but I just don't know). I have personally been lied to or misinformed by health care organizations I used to trust. The proof of that is that they themselves have spread polar opposite conflicting information on this stinking virus.

I will say that I will NEVER criticize anybody who wishes to take this vaccine, or ANYBODY who doesn't or ANYBODY who is not sure and wants to wait. It all boils down to a lack of trust on my part. I have no idea of who is right or who I can trust on this and other issues. Zero. None.
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Re: Will you take a Covid 19 vaccine?

Post by wosbald » Tue Dec 22, 2020 11:48 am

+JMJ+
tuttle wrote:
Tue Dec 22, 2020 10:44 am
[…]

… But sometimes I run away with analogies until I can't remember what we're talking about anymore.

[…]
Ya don't say.

:pie:

ImageImage

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Re: Will you take a Covid 19 vaccine?

Post by JimVH » Mon Dec 28, 2020 11:59 am

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Re: Will you take a Covid 19 vaccine?

Post by Cleon » Mon Dec 28, 2020 12:25 pm

JimVH wrote:
Mon Dec 28, 2020 11:59 am
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Re: Will you take a Covid 19 vaccine?

Post by Hovannes » Wed Dec 30, 2020 6:39 pm

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DEUS VULT!

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Re: Will you take a Covid 19 vaccine?

Post by JimVH » Thu Dec 31, 2020 5:40 pm

I decided to take one and got declined by the hospital managing the program because I had a Tdap booster earlier in the month.

Be safe. But not too safe.

I’m on a waiting list now.
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Re: Will you take a Covid 19 vaccine?

Post by joegoat » Thu Dec 31, 2020 5:53 pm

Ol' DeSwine is shocked that 60% of nursing home workers are turning it down. I haven't seen him stepping up to get it yet though.

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Re: Will you take a Covid 19 vaccine?

Post by joegoat » Thu Dec 31, 2020 5:56 pm

Stanley76 wrote:My issue is not trusting any of the institutions I used to trust on medical issues. The W.H.O., C.D.C., my own HCPs, the news, everything seems to be contradictory on Covid. It came naturally from bat. No, it came from a lab in Wuhan, well yeah but they were experimenting on bat viruses. It was released from a wet market, no it was released accidentally from the lab, no it was released on the world as a bioweapons attack. It's no worse than the flu, it's much worse than the flu, it will kill us all, it only kills .3% of those who contract it. The Covid deaths are inflated and most of the deaths are from people with pre-existing conditions, no the Covid death numbers are accurate, no they aren't. Hydroxycholorquine cures Covid, no it will kill you, now it works again. You can catch it by touching surfaces, no you can only catch it if you breath in the virus from someone who is infected. Masks don't work, masks do work, some masks work, some masks might work. You should wear latex gloves in public, no you shouldn't. A vaccine takes years to develop and test, no it only takes six months. China wants to barcode vaccinated people or microchip them, no they don't. The vaccine is made from aborted baby stem cells, no it's not it's made from research done on aborted baby stem cells, no some of the ones they are working on now don't use stem cells. VP Pence took the vaccine, no he didn't he got shot up with distilled water. You won't be able to go in a store or travel without proof of vaccination, yes you will be able to do what ever you want vaccinated or not. If you catch it and recover you are immune, no it mutates and you'll have to get vaccinated every year just like the flu. It IS the flu (from a doctor), not it's not (from another doctor. From my own HC facility, two nurses have told me they will not take it unless forced to to keep their job. From another nurse I know, we HAVE to take it to get the country moving again.

Seriously, I have no clue of who to believe or trust. When that happens I usually step back and watch and see what happens with my own eyes. I have friends who are going to take it. I'll see what happens to them (probably nothing but I just don't know). I have personally been lied to or misinformed by health care organizations I used to trust. The proof of that is that they themselves have spread polar opposite conflicting information on this stinking virus.

I will say that I will NEVER criticize anybody who wishes to take this vaccine, or ANYBODY who doesn't or ANYBODY who is not sure and wants to wait. It all boils down to a lack of trust on my part. I have no idea of who is right or who I can trust on this and other issues. Zero. None.
Well said. I agree completely!

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Re: Will you take a Covid 19 vaccine?

Post by Jocosoe » Thu Dec 31, 2020 6:45 pm

I can't relate™.
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Re: Will you take a Covid 19 vaccine?

Post by AnungUnRama » Thu Dec 31, 2020 7:26 pm

Cleon wrote:
JimVH wrote:
Mon Dec 28, 2020 11:59 am
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That last sentence right there. That is the biggest bull scat problem with this and any other vaccine. THIS.

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Re: Will you take a Covid 19 vaccine?

Post by JimVH » Tue Jan 05, 2021 4:59 pm

JimVH wrote:
Mon Dec 28, 2020 11:59 am
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Re: Will you take a Covid 19 vaccine?

Post by FredS » Tue Jan 05, 2021 5:56 pm

I think the HCW's are taking it less than expected here too. They've already rolled over to the second tier and many networks are starting to take appointments for tier 3 (elderly) folks.
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Re: Will you take a Covid 19 vaccine?

Post by Tatanka » Wed Jan 06, 2021 9:12 am

Del wrote:
Fri Dec 18, 2020 8:51 pm
Roadmaster wrote:
Thu Dec 17, 2020 7:09 pm
Stanley76 wrote:
Thu Dec 17, 2020 5:48 pm
AFRS wrote:
Thu Dec 17, 2020 5:10 pm
Are we going to talk about the woman in Alaska who had no known allergies but went into anaphylaxis after getting vaxxed?
I will.
Seat belts don't always work either.
Let's all get real here....

Every year, people die from getting flu shots. I believe that number is close to 200 per year. That is considered an acceptable risk, in order to protect tens of thousands of people who are at risk from the wild virus.

A whole lot more people are going to get the covid vaccine.... because our elite experts and politicians tell us that we must, in order to return to our normal lives.

So we should expect that about a thousand Americans -- more or less -- will die from reactions to the covid vaccine. If we try to vaccinate every American in the next 6 months, there will be about 6 people per day who will die from the covid shot.

This is a price we must endure if we want to get back to our jobs, and see our kids in school, and enjoy a few beers at the pub.
Off Topic
For perspective, we tolerate the killing of 2500 American children each and every day.

The media pushed panic and fear of covid upon us by telling sensational stories about a young, healthy person who died from the virus.

There will be similar panic spread against the vaccine.... stories of some individuals who died from the shot.

this game only benefits those who desire panic and fear. Ignore them all.
Sounds reasonable to me. Have we reached the "modern!!" time when even saying, much less practicing" "Common Sense" is politically incorrect? Someday the Socialists will no doubt insist we only use one brand of toilet paper! Criminitly! Common Sense people!
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Re: Will you take a Covid 19 vaccine?

Post by AFRS » Fri Jan 08, 2021 10:56 pm

Not about Covid vaccine per-se but oh my goodness

STUDY: Bill Gates DTP Vaccine Killed 10 Times More African Girls Than The Disease Itself

Do you really want to take a vaccine that Gates has anything to do with?

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Re: Will you take a Covid 19 vaccine?

Post by adauria » Mon Jan 11, 2021 9:57 am

AFRS wrote:
Fri Jan 08, 2021 10:56 pm

Do you really want to take a vaccine that Gates has anything to do with?
Tragic about the DTP thing, but really irrelevant to anything around the COVID vaccines. It's not like Gates had anything to do with the DTP or COVID vaccines directly, i.e. from a technical development side of things. The vaccines are based on different technologies altogether. I'm not saying it means the COVID vaccine is without risk, but simply associating both vaccines with Bill Gates and then using that as a reason to avoid one of them makes no sense at all.

However, I can attest to the fact that MS Windows is highly prone to viruses, and can directly attribute some of that Bill Gates.

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Re: Will you take a Covid 19 vaccine?

Post by Cleon » Mon Jan 11, 2021 11:12 am

My sis is a nurse. She got the first shot with no problems and is scheduled to take the second one this week. Her supervisor told her that the second shot hurt like an SOB and that she can take the next day off if she needs to since the symptoms are more than noticeable in a lot of people. The supervisor was in bed with a 102 fever.
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Re: Will you take a Covid 19 vaccine?

Post by Stanley76 » Mon Jan 11, 2021 12:27 pm

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Re: Will you take a Covid 19 vaccine?

Post by FredS » Mon Jan 11, 2021 12:32 pm

Cleon wrote:
Mon Jan 11, 2021 11:12 am
My sis is a nurse. She got the first shot with no problems and is scheduled to take the second one this week. Her supervisor told her that the second shot hurt like an SOB and that she can take the next day off if she needs to since the symptoms are more than noticeable in a lot of people. The supervisor was in bed with a 102 fever.
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