More Tobacco Bad, Taxes Good Legislation

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Del
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Re: More Tobacco Bad, Taxes Good Legislation

Post by Del » Fri Apr 02, 2021 12:08 pm

coco wrote:
Fri Apr 02, 2021 11:37 am
Image
I remember how much I detested Bill Clinton when he was president, simply because he was pro-abortion. It went right along with his skirt-chasing disrespect for women.

But old Bill was a master statesman, and he was pleased to leave America alone and let us thrive. His cooperation with Newt even allowed the federal govt to achieve a balance budget, if only for just a little while. And he brokered a lasting peace in Northern Ireland, lending hope to those who want real peace in the Middle East. Trump almost got us there, by doing similar to what Bill did.

Now I truly wish that Democrats could just be like the old skirt-chasing pig.

If more Democrats could be like Bill, and more Republicans could be like Trump (even with their combined flaws), we could get this nation back on a firm foundation. And then we could stop blaming everything little thing on racism.

That would be nice.
G.K. Chesterton — 'It is terrible to contemplate how few politicians are hanged.'

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Re: More Tobacco Bad, Taxes Good Legislation

Post by Adam Z » Fri Apr 02, 2021 3:11 pm

[T.A.D. INTENSIFIES]....

I guess we know how the democrats plan to pay for the recent "infrastructure" bills now.
Last edited by Adam Z on Fri Apr 02, 2021 4:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: More Tobacco Bad, Taxes Good Legislation

Post by Goose55 » Fri Apr 02, 2021 3:41 pm

JimVH wrote:
Thu Apr 01, 2021 10:53 am
Full Article: New Bill Seeks to Dramatically Increase Federal Taxes on Tobacco Products

This would bring a 1650% increase in pipe tobacco taxes.
Tobacco Business Magazine wrote:Here’s how the tax parity, as defined by Section 5701(g) of the Internal Revenue Code of 1986, could change for each product category:

Small Cigarettes: From $50.33 to $100.66
Large Cigarettes: From $105.69 to $211.38
Roll-Your-Own Tobacco: From $24.78, amended to $49.56
Pipe Tobacco Tobacco: From $2.8311 cents to $49.56
Smokeless Tobacco: In paragraph (1) of Section 5701(e), from $1.51 to $26.84; paragraph (2), from $50.33 cents to $10.74
Small Cigars: From $50.33 to $100.66
Large Cigars: From 52.75 percent to $49.56 per pound and a proportionate tax at the like rate on all fractional parts of a pound but not less than 10.066 cents per cigar
Looks like large cigars would take the least hit. I wonder why.
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Re: More Tobacco Bad, Taxes Good Legislation

Post by joegoat » Fri Apr 02, 2021 4:15 pm

Goose55 wrote:
JimVH wrote:
Thu Apr 01, 2021 10:53 am
Full Article: New Bill Seeks to Dramatically Increase Federal Taxes on Tobacco Products

This would bring a 1650% increase in pipe tobacco taxes.
Tobacco Business Magazine wrote:Here’s how the tax parity, as defined by Section 5701(g) of the Internal Revenue Code of 1986, could change for each product category:

Small Cigarettes: From $50.33 to $100.66
Large Cigarettes: From $105.69 to $211.38
Roll-Your-Own Tobacco: From $24.78, amended to $49.56
Pipe Tobacco Tobacco: From $2.8311 cents to $49.56
Smokeless Tobacco: In paragraph (1) of Section 5701(e), from $1.51 to $26.84; paragraph (2), from $50.33 cents to $10.74
Small Cigars: From $50.33 to $100.66
Large Cigars: From 52.75 percent to $49.56 per pound and a proportionate tax at the like rate on all fractional parts of a pound but not less than 10.066 cents per cigar
Looks like large cigars would take the least hit. I wonder why.
High quality tobacco products have stayed safe for so long because no matter what the Dems say, they ultimately want to tax the lower class. The tobacco products used by the lower classes are taxed the heaviest in the name of trying to help people for health reasons. When they say they'll tax the corporations, who are they really taxing? The people who buy items or services from them will pay the tax through increased prices.

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Re: More Tobacco Bad, Taxes Good Legislation

Post by coco » Fri Apr 09, 2021 5:05 pm

Are the pipe tobacco taxes on a per ounce basis? (That would make a pound of tobacco have $792.96 in tax.)
There are many terrible attributes of the lowly cob. Not the least of them is that it makes you look like a doof.

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Re: More Tobacco Bad, Taxes Good Legislation

Post by JimVH » Fri Apr 09, 2021 5:48 pm

coco wrote:
Fri Apr 09, 2021 5:05 pm
Are the pipe tobacco taxes on a per ounce basis? (That would make a pound of tobacco have $792.96 in tax.)
26 U.S. Code § 5701 - Rate of tax wrote:(f) Pipe tobacco
On pipe tobacco, manufactured in or imported into the United States, there shall be imposed a tax of $2.8311 cents per pound (and a proportionate tax at the like rate on all fractional parts of a pound).
https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/26/5701

Cigar tax info is in the link, also.
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Re: More Tobacco Bad, Taxes Good Legislation

Post by coco » Sat Apr 10, 2021 3:03 pm

JimVH wrote:
Fri Apr 09, 2021 5:48 pm
coco wrote:
Fri Apr 09, 2021 5:05 pm
Are the pipe tobacco taxes on a per ounce basis? (That would make a pound of tobacco have $792.96 in tax.)
26 U.S. Code § 5701 - Rate of tax wrote:(f) Pipe tobacco
On pipe tobacco, manufactured in or imported into the United States, there shall be imposed a tax of $2.8311 cents per pound (and a proportionate tax at the like rate on all fractional parts of a pound).
https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/26/5701

Cigar tax info is in the link, also.
Okay.

A 1650% increase in taxes is egregious, but it doesn't kill the hobby outright. You're looking at a 2 oz. tin increasing by about $6.

That being said, Rusty said that they would double the taxes every so often in Canada, and insisted they would probably start doing so here.

It's the beginning of the end, not the end.
There are many terrible attributes of the lowly cob. Not the least of them is that it makes you look like a doof.

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Re: More Tobacco Bad, Taxes Good Legislation

Post by lordhavemercy » Sun Apr 11, 2021 11:39 am

Man, seems like a rough time to acquire this as a hobby. I guess that means stock up now. I also happened to order some seed a week ago, but I don’t suspect I’ll have great luck here in Maine.

Can anyone recommend any authoritative sources on curing and preparing from fresh leaf to blend? I’ve watched a bunch of YouTube videos and read a handful of random experiments on forums, but I haven’t found anything from what appears an authoritative source. I have a bio/chemistry background and am as much interested in the technical as I am the historical and traditional. But mostly I just want to be able to produce high quality smoke ;)

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Re: More Tobacco Bad, Taxes Good Legislation

Post by coco » Tue Apr 13, 2021 3:30 pm

lordhavemercy wrote:
Sun Apr 11, 2021 11:39 am
Man, seems like a rough time to acquire this as a hobby. I guess that means stock up now. I also happened to order some seed a week ago, but I don’t suspect I’ll have great luck here in Maine.

Can anyone recommend any authoritative sources on curing and preparing from fresh leaf to blend? I’ve watched a bunch of YouTube videos and read a handful of random experiments on forums, but I haven’t found anything from what appears an authoritative source. I have a bio/chemistry background and am as much interested in the technical as I am the historical and traditional. But mostly I just want to be able to produce high quality smoke ;)
The changes in the short term will not significantly affect most of us here. You are looking at the cost of a single tin going from about $15 to about $21. Most of us here can afford a six dollar increase per tin, as the yearly costs wouldn't crush our budgets.

Where things go from here depends on the desires of the politicians who are in control. If they simply want to make money, the way to do it is to use a monopolistic pricing scheme on the taxes they impose.* This would maximize profit, which is the goal of many politicians.

There are a couple of reasons that they probably will try to increase taxes much more than what would be demanded by monopolistic pricing. First, they may be too dumb to understand the supply and demand curve of Economics 101. Such people figure that more taxes always means more money, and so they keep raising them.

The other reason that they may keep raising taxes is that they may have a different goal than making money: to eliminate smoking via taxes. Many countries have raised taxes to the point that a tin is well over $50, so that no one can afford to smoke. This approach does not maximize tax income for the government, but it does get rid of smoking within that country. One of the favorite tactics of the politician is to point out how "we are behind other countries."

I would love to see more discussion on CPS about growing and curing your own. As you research and experiment, please share your experiences with us.



*The government is the sole producer of taxes, and so monopolistic pricing is implied. I think this is true though the marginal economic cost is fairly negligible, and thus the tax price would be set solely according to the marginal benefit to the customer.
There are many terrible attributes of the lowly cob. Not the least of them is that it makes you look like a doof.

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Re: More Tobacco Bad, Taxes Good Legislation

Post by SlowToke » Tue Apr 13, 2021 4:03 pm

I tried to grow tobacco one year. The insects ate the whole crop down to the nub. I may have to give it another go here at the new tick farm.
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