Really angry pastor in the news

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Re: Really angry pastor in the news

Post by tuttle » Mon Apr 05, 2021 1:25 pm

FredS wrote:
Mon Apr 05, 2021 11:33 am
tuttle wrote:
Mon Apr 05, 2021 10:25 am
FredS wrote:
Mon Apr 05, 2021 9:54 am
tuttle wrote:
Mon Apr 05, 2021 8:39 am
. . . if so, that guy is a legend.
I say he's a %fracking idiot, not a legend.

Gestapo Nazi psychopaths? I suppose the cops were there because someone called them to report violation of a mask mandate or law limiting the size of a gathering but I don't know that for sure. If that's the case though, police walking peacefully in to and out of his church building because he was breaking the law is hardly on the same level as the holocaust. That jackass needs to take a trip to China if he wants to see persecution and intimidation. But hey - by god he made a heroic stand in the face of evil! Thank goodness he was fortunate enough to catch it all on his cell phone to share with the world how brave and defiant he is. His on-screen rant there at the end was just great.
1. The guy was born in communist Poland. I don't think a trip to China is necessary.

2. This is right off the heels of Canada jailing a pastor for 35 days violating Covid regulations.

3. Regardless of his colorful use of epithets, he was well within his rights to tell them to leave if they don't have a warrant (insofar as I've seen on reports). Now, while I would likely choose a different way of handling it, I happen to agree with his logic regarding the name calling. I see what the purpose was.

4. Also according to reports, this isn't the first time the state has interfered with this guy so it seems his claim that their presence was meant to intimidate worshippers is valid to some degree.
1. The guy needs to reflect on the persecution he may have seen as a boy. Then realize those Canadian cops weren't doing anything near that. Then learn how to be situationaly aware. Then learn how not to totally lose his %fracking mind when he feels threatened or uncomfortable. Canada has (or wants) some pretty severe - unreasonable, I think - laws on hate speech and I dare say the things this whackadoodle screamed at the cops are bumping right up against that.

2. Other pastors being jailed for breaking the law is no excuse for his temper tantrum.

3. I'm not sure he was within his rights to ask them to leave. Are the cops not allowed to enter a building when and where they suspect a crime is being committed or where someone expressly reported a crime being committed? Perhaps they ransacked the place searching for evidence of a crime or questioned people before the video started but all we saw were the cops entering and exiting a building that was presumably open to the public when they entered.

4. One wonders why this guy has a history of 'state interference'. What is he doing to draw their attention and why? You and I will distill this down until we understand that neither of us wants jackbooted thugs standing on our necks preventing the free practice of religion and free assembly, but I wonder if this guy's history of breaking the law or tweaking the cops - and broadcasting it at least this once - is more about him than it is about Jesus.
1. The point isn't that the Canadian cops are actually Nazis or Gestapo, but that they are operating in the same 'spirit' of cracking down on freedoms. And I'm not saying whether or not Jesus would give his stamp of approval in this situation, but there is a similarity in Jesus and the Baptist calling their authorities vipers and whitewashed tombs and such. In other words, this pastor (as I read it) wasn't saying this to identify them as much as it was to shame them.

2. This didn't sound like a temper tantrum as much as it was fury. Whether it was righteous fury or not it seems folks have different opinions. I viewed it as a shepherd making a point rather than a toddler throwing a fit. And the uploading it to the internet isn't a tantrum, but purposeful which I think is further evidence that he's making a point.

3. I don't know Canadian law. It seems demanding a warrant was a legitimate as the cops just left and didn't smash his face into the concrete. But then again, Canadians are so nice, perhaps they just left even though he was wrong.

4. I don't know how far we want to branch this out but I took a look at his wiki page. Seems he's a conservative firebrand, fit more for the American Bible Belt than the Great North but I couldn't find anything much more damning than that. But having a wiki page means people know who he is, even if we don't, and whether he's a lightning rod for the right reasons or wrong, it's beyond me at the moment.

Whatever the case, it is undeniable that COVID restrictions have placed both churches and cops in some tension. In cultures rooted in religious liberty any encroachment, for safety or otherwise, is going to cause pushback. And there is a growing feeling among some churches that the COVID regulations are being abused by some. You see the same feeling in pockets across the US. Canada took it one step farther by arresting a pastor over it and so tensions are higher. People like me look at that situation and find it incredible that a Pastor would be arrested--doing the very thing my church and many others have been doing the whole time--having worship in person.
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Re: Really angry pastor in the news

Post by DepartedLight » Mon Apr 05, 2021 1:36 pm

wosbald wrote:
Mon Apr 05, 2021 12:18 pm
+JMJ+

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I like this one. :lol:
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Re: Really angry pastor in the news

Post by FredS » Mon Apr 05, 2021 1:41 pm

AFRS wrote:
Mon Apr 05, 2021 1:21 pm
tuttle wrote:
Mon Apr 05, 2021 10:32 am
Bloodhound wrote:
Mon Apr 05, 2021 10:08 am
Romans 13 1-5

13 1 Everyone must submit to governing authorities. For all authority comes from God, and those in positions of authority have been placed there by God. 2 So anyone who rebels against authority is rebelling against what God has instituted, and they will be punished. 3 For the authorities do not strike fear in people who are doing right, but in those who are doing wrong. Would you like to live without fear of the authorities? Do what is right, and they will honor you. 4 The authorities are God's servants, sent for your good. But if you are doing wrong, of course you should be afraid, for they have the power to punish you. They are God's servants, sent for the very purpose of punishing those who do what is wrong. 5 So you must submit to them, not only to avoid punishment, but also to keep a clear conscience.
What happens when the government tells you to violate your conscience? So that your submission to them muddles it, rather than clears it?

This passage is good and should be soberly reflected upon. But it cannot be used as a blanket catch-all for obeying the State, especially in light of both the Old and New Testament clearly revealing people breaking the law or defying the government as good examples for us. Guys like Peter and John and Paul.
+1
Does a government mandate to wear a mask when you're around others violate your conscience? If so, why?

On one hand I see protecting it's citizens from harm brought on the by others to be one of the highest governmental responsibilities. I also think the Church carries responsibility in protecting it's flock and social distancing and masks when gathered don't seem unreasonable, to me, in all but the most isolated communities.

On the other hand I can understand this particular "protection" being unreasonable among consenting adults. Sort of like how progressives are impinging on the Churches traditional role to care for those on the margins by collecting higher taxes so they can be the one to offer such charity. Is the State justified in protecting people when the Church doesn't? Because, you know, they know what's best for us.
Last edited by FredS on Mon Apr 05, 2021 1:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Really angry pastor in the news

Post by JMG » Mon Apr 05, 2021 1:44 pm

DepartedLight wrote:
Mon Apr 05, 2021 1:16 pm
I do wish he'd of stopped tongue wagging when they left through the door.
I agree.
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Re: Really angry pastor in the news

Post by durangopipe » Mon Apr 05, 2021 2:13 pm

Same pastor on Youtube.






I’m sorry, but I don’t believe that public health measures to stem the Covid pandemic are actually the government’s attempt to suppress Christianity.

He did to that poor pharmacy clerk something similar to what he did to those policemen. At least, thankfully, this time without the name calling and yelling. He clearly went in there knowing what would happen, than acted surprised when it did. If she’d waited on him she could have lost her job.

If public health measures appear “trial and error” and therefore sometimes seem in retrospect as having been either excessive or not strong enough that’s because public health officials are having to learn about the virus (and it’s mutations) while in the middle of a public health crisis and adapt as the pandemic progresses. Yes, it is, to some degree, trial and error - just like battlefield decisions in the middle of war.

We’re approaching 3 million deaths worldwide and 560,000 in the U.S.
Without public health strategies it would most certainly be a lot worse.

Check out Brazil (where the head of state remains in denial):

https://www.cnbc.com/2021/03/30/covid-i ... orter.html

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Re: Really angry pastor in the news

Post by FredS » Mon Apr 05, 2021 2:52 pm

It's no great leap for me, after seeing this video where he says the government want's to "eliminate" the middle class, to imagine the good pastor himself set in the motion that visit by the police to his church. The way he torments that poor clerk shows he has no problem hurting others to advance his cause, so he probably wouldn't have a second thought about asking a parishioner to call the cops to report an illegal gathering in order to ambush confront them when they walk in.
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Re: Really angry pastor in the news

Post by Jester » Mon Apr 05, 2021 3:06 pm

FredS wrote:
Mon Apr 05, 2021 2:52 pm
It's no great leap for me, after seeing this video where he says the government want's to "eliminate" the middle class, to imagine the good pastor himself set in the motion that visit by the police to his church. The way he torments that poor clerk shows he has no problem hurting others to advance his cause, so he probably wouldn't have a second thought about asking a parishioner to call the cops to report an illegal gathering in order to ambush confront them when they walk in.
That is quite an accusation.
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Re: Really angry pastor in the news

Post by FredS » Mon Apr 05, 2021 3:44 pm

Jester wrote:
Mon Apr 05, 2021 3:06 pm
FredS wrote:
Mon Apr 05, 2021 2:52 pm
It's no great leap for me, after seeing this video where he says the government want's to "eliminate" the middle class, to imagine the good pastor himself set in the motion that visit by the police to his church. The way he torments that poor clerk shows he has no problem hurting others to advance his cause, so he probably wouldn't have a second thought about asking a parishioner to call the cops to report an illegal gathering in order to ambush confront them when they walk in.
That is quite an accusation.
FWIW (which is nothing) I'll stand on it.

I already wrote I think he's a %fracking idiot based on the original post. Now I'm convinced he's a hateful %fracking idiot who went to a store intent on creating a confrontation and filming and broadcasting a video by harassing a clerk to further his position that Covid 19 is a "hoax" and that the Canadian government cooked it all up to trample the rights of Christians. I have no problem at all supposing he would set the cops up just like he did that girl. He's a clown.

EDIT: Is it lost on this %fracking idiot that the same set of rights he has to ask cops (or anyone else who causes disruption or fear) to leave his church is afforded the workers who asked him to leave their shop and refuse to serve him because he's posing a threat? Whether you feel Covid is a threat or not, he clearly violated the shop keepers policy by entering the store without a mask and refused to leave when asked by agents of that shop keeper. Sounds like trespass to me.
Last edited by FredS on Mon Apr 05, 2021 4:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Really angry pastor in the news

Post by wosbald » Mon Apr 05, 2021 3:53 pm

+JMJ+

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Re: Really angry pastor in the news

Post by JMG » Mon Apr 05, 2021 4:09 pm

If we are making assumptions, and choose, for the sake of this discussion, to view this as a stand-alone event, we could see this as a man with a righteousness indignation over the disruption of a sacred celebration and therefor God as well.

In this sense, how would this differ from Christ’s reaction to the money changers in the temple? Now I know that it is tempting to pull the, “We aren’t Jesus” card. However, we are called to be Christlike. That being the case, we can not overlook his response to the desecration of the temple. Certainly, all of our actions should be rooted in love, and one may take from the pastor’s response that he was not loving, however, it may be that many would have viewed, or still view, Jesus’ reaction as unloving.

So we are clear, I think this topic is a worthwhile one and as believers warrants that we flesh it out in our own hearts. I am not trying to poke the bear or stir anyone up. I mean this as a genuine question.
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Re: Really angry pastor in the news

Post by FredS » Mon Apr 05, 2021 4:39 pm

Pointing at no one in particular -

Let's ask ourselves: Who stands to profit (that was the main problem Jesus had with the money changers and dove sellers in the temple, right?) - from the series of videos we've seen in this thread? I'm not necessarily talking about money here, but yeah, money. Beside that, who's seeking and getting our attention? Is God working in these videos?
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Re: Really angry pastor in the news

Post by Del » Mon Apr 05, 2021 4:59 pm

FredS wrote:
Mon Apr 05, 2021 9:54 am
tuttle wrote:
Mon Apr 05, 2021 8:39 am
. . . if so, that guy is a legend.
I say he's a %fracking idiot, not a legend.

Gestapo Nazi psychopaths? I suppose the cops were there because someone called them to report violation of a mask mandate or law limiting the size of a gathering but I don't know that for sure. If that's the case though, police walking peacefully in to and out of his church building because he was breaking the law is hardly on the same level as the holocaust. That jackass needs to take a trip to China if he wants to see persecution and intimidation. But hey - by god he made a heroic stand in the face of evil! Thank goodness he was fortunate enough to catch it all on his cell phone to share with the world how brave and defiant he is. His on-screen rant there at the end was just great.
Normally, we are justified in piling on anyone who starts shouting about Nazis and Gestapo and fascists.

But this pastor is from Poland. He likely heard horrific accounts from his own parents and grandparents about Nazis and Gestapo barging into churches and synagogues. He speaks with authority.

Even communists in Poland were careful to avoid disrupting religious services in progress. The Poles were barely willing to tolerate a police state. They weren't going to stand for more nazis.
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Re: Really angry pastor in the news

Post by FredS » Mon Apr 05, 2021 5:18 pm

Del wrote:
Mon Apr 05, 2021 4:59 pm
FredS wrote:
Mon Apr 05, 2021 9:54 am
tuttle wrote:
Mon Apr 05, 2021 8:39 am
. . . if so, that guy is a legend.
I say he's a %fracking idiot, not a legend.

Gestapo Nazi psychopaths? I suppose the cops were there because someone called them to report violation of a mask mandate or law limiting the size of a gathering but I don't know that for sure. If that's the case though, police walking peacefully in to and out of his church building because he was breaking the law is hardly on the same level as the holocaust. That jackass needs to take a trip to China if he wants to see persecution and intimidation. But hey - by god he made a heroic stand in the face of evil! Thank goodness he was fortunate enough to catch it all on his cell phone to share with the world how brave and defiant he is. His on-screen rant there at the end was just great.
Normally, we are justified in piling on anyone who starts shouting about Nazis and Gestapo and fascists.

But this pastor is from Poland. He likely heard horrific accounts from his own parents and grandparents about Nazis and Gestapo barging into churches and synagogues. He speaks with authority.

Even communists in Poland were careful to avoid disrupting religious services in progress. The Poles were barely willing to tolerate a police state. They weren't going to stand for more nazis.
He's no more justified in acting as he did than anyone else would be. I've heard horrific accounts from my parents and grandparents. I've been through some s*** myself. Is it alright if treat people like that? Can I go around calling people murderers, rapists, and thieves just because all those things have touched my history? Let's not excuse or even justify this guys present-day actions and phony cries of persecution because he had a rough start in life, no matter how bad it may have been. If he's that broken he needs help and should step down until he gets it.
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Re: Really angry pastor in the news

Post by JMG » Mon Apr 05, 2021 5:43 pm

FredS wrote:
Mon Apr 05, 2021 4:39 pm
Pointing at no one in particular -

Let's ask ourselves: Who stands to profit (that was the main problem Jesus had with the money changers and dove sellers in the temple, right?) - from the series of videos we've seen in this thread? I'm not necessarily talking about money here, but yeah, money. Beside that, who's seeking and getting our attention? Is God working in these videos?
So, a close-to-home example of who stands to profit, would be that of a few churches up in the Delta of MS. A few months back, one particular church in general was intentionally targeted by local government and law enforcement. As much as I can remember they were adhering to all local and federal regulations. In fact, everyone in attendance remained in their vehicles at all time with the exception of the pastor and maybe another staff member or two. Also, even the vehicles were spaced out in the parking lot. Law enforcement showed up and began issuing tickets to everyone in attendance. In a situation like that, the government were the only ones profiting. But I'm not sure what exactly you are trying to get at. Who do you think "profited" from this pastor's altercation? Also, if you look at this incident by itself for the sake of what I believe is a good topic of consideration, do you see any cross over between it and that of Jesus in the temple with the money changers?
Last edited by JMG on Mon Apr 05, 2021 8:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Really angry pastor in the news

Post by Del » Mon Apr 05, 2021 8:14 pm

FredS wrote:
Mon Apr 05, 2021 5:18 pm
Del wrote:
Mon Apr 05, 2021 4:59 pm
FredS wrote:
Mon Apr 05, 2021 9:54 am
tuttle wrote:
Mon Apr 05, 2021 8:39 am
. . . if so, that guy is a legend.
I say he's a %fracking idiot, not a legend.

Gestapo Nazi psychopaths? I suppose the cops were there because someone called them to report violation of a mask mandate or law limiting the size of a gathering but I don't know that for sure. If that's the case though, police walking peacefully in to and out of his church building because he was breaking the law is hardly on the same level as the holocaust. That jackass needs to take a trip to China if he wants to see persecution and intimidation. But hey - by god he made a heroic stand in the face of evil! Thank goodness he was fortunate enough to catch it all on his cell phone to share with the world how brave and defiant he is. His on-screen rant there at the end was just great.
Normally, we are justified in piling on anyone who starts shouting about Nazis and Gestapo and fascists.

But this pastor is from Poland. He likely heard horrific accounts from his own parents and grandparents about Nazis and Gestapo barging into churches and synagogues. He speaks with authority.

Even communists in Poland were careful to avoid disrupting religious services in progress. The Poles were barely willing to tolerate a police state. They weren't going to stand for more nazis.
He's no more justified in acting as he did than anyone else would be. I've heard horrific accounts from my parents and grandparents. I've been through some s*** myself. Is it alright if treat people like that? Can I go around calling people murderers, rapists, and thieves just because all those things have touched my history? Let's not excuse or even justify this guys present-day actions and phony cries of persecution because he had a rough start in life, no matter how bad it may have been. If he's that broken he needs help and should step down until he gets it.
Okay.... I see your point. We were appalled by those BLM spokes-folks who cried on about oppression, systemic racism, voter suppression, etc. This fellow's case is the pretty much the same.

I guess I support any effort by any local leader who stands up to the prolonged enforcement of emergency covid measures. It's time to push back.

But we don't need to berate the poor store clerks (unless they call the cops) or call the cops "nazis" (unless they don't have a warrant).
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Re: Really angry pastor in the news

Post by durangopipe » Mon Apr 05, 2021 8:48 pm

“Dell” wrote:But this pastor is from Poland. He likely heard horrific accounts from his own parents and grandparents about Nazis and Gestapo barging into churches and synagogues. He speaks with authority.
...and he should, for that very reason, know the difference between his local police force and the Nazis, the Gestapo and communists.

Nobody has been summarily shot or shipped off to a death camp, the government has not nationalized industry or seized private property, sent political dissidents to the gulag or had the members of the political opposition assassinated.

The government has not made worship illegal. Worship continues. Worship in capacity filled churches will resume. Christians can speak of their faith freely. Christians can share their faith freely. Christians can read the Bible. (They had to hide them in the USSR).

People can accuse the government and their local police of being the Gestapo, Nazis and communists without being imprisoned or worse.

Americans are babies.

They won’t wear a facemask for the greater good for a few months because it’s uncomfortable. (Or they are not sure it’s for the greater good - which is analogous to the theology of children.)

They won’t worship on Zoom or in smaller groups for a little while because it’s “Like Nazi Germany.”

No it isn’t, or any of those things he screamed at his local police officers in front of his impressionable parishioners.
Not. Even. Remotely. Close.

We should all know better.

This grandstanding pastor does know better.

Apparently uniforms trigger him because of his past.
He’s a pastor. He can’t be a snowflake. He needs to grow up and be a man.

Or ...
He wasn’t actually triggered because of his past. He’s just a publicity hound. It’s all for show. Like the crap at the pharmacy counter.

Go to 1 Wos.

My wife is in public health. She sometimes cries herself to sleep precisely because of theses kinds of Ill-informed arguments that are fed by conspiracy theories and political divisions that are utterly unrelated to the actual public health issues and fueled by paranoid people who have spent too much time staring into the dark hole of radical left- and radical right-wing social media and unreliable news sources.

“They” are out to get us. Go an inch or two further down that road and you’ll need a straight jacket.

Meanwhile, we’re looking at the possibility of a fourth wave, this time of variants that are hospitalizing and killing more young people. I wish everyone could sit in on just one public health professionals’ briefing (without of course being disruptive and ignorantly yelling, “Lies!”)

Look at Europe.
Look at South America.

Look at yourself.

Rage quit #1 for me.
See you in awhile.

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Re: Really angry pastor in the news

Post by JMG » Mon Apr 05, 2021 9:28 pm

durangopipe wrote:
Mon Apr 05, 2021 8:48 pm
“Dell” wrote:But this pastor is from Poland. He likely heard horrific accounts from his own parents and grandparents about Nazis and Gestapo barging into churches and synagogues. He speaks with authority.
...and he should, for that very reason, know the difference between his local police force and the Nazis, the Gestapo and communists.

Nobody has been summarily shot or shipped off to a death camp, the government has not nationalized industry or seized private property, sent political dissidents to the gulag or had the members of the political opposition assassinated.

The government has not made worship illegal. Worship continues. Worship in capacity filled churches will resume. Christians can speak of their faith freely. Christians can share their faith freely. Christians can read the Bible. (They had to hide them in the USSR).

People can accuse the government and their local police of being the Gestapo, Nazis and communists without being imprisoned or worse.

Americans are babies.

They won’t wear a facemask for the greater good for a few months because it’s uncomfortable. (Or they are not sure it’s for the greater good - which is analogous to the theology of children.)

They won’t worship on Zoom or in smaller groups for a little while because it’s “Like Nazi Germany.”

No it isn’t, or any of those things he screamed at his local police officers in front of his impressionable parishioners.
Not. Even. Remotely. Close.

We should all know better.

This grandstanding pastor does know better.

Apparently uniforms trigger him because of his past.
He’s a pastor. He can’t be a snowflake. He needs to grow up and be a man.

Or ...
He wasn’t actually triggered because of his past. He’s just a publicity hound. It’s all for show. Like the crap at the pharmacy counter.

Go to 1 Wos.

My wife is in public health. She sometimes cries herself to sleep precisely because of theses kinds of Ill-informed arguments that are fed by conspiracy theories and political divisions that are utterly unrelated to the actual public health issues and fueled by paranoid people who have spent too much time staring into the dark hole of radical left- and radical right-wing social media and unreliable news sources.

“They” are out to get us. Go an inch or two further down that road and you’ll need a straight jacket.

Meanwhile, we’re looking at the possibility of a fourth wave, this time of variants that are hospitalizing and killing more young people. I wish everyone could sit in on just one public health professionals’ briefing (without of course being disruptive and ignorantly yelling, “Lies!”)

Look at Europe.
Look at South America.

Look at yourself.

Rage quit #1 for me.
See you in awhile.
Hope the rage subsides soon and doesn't fester. I'll pray towards that end.

When you come back, and if you feel up to answering, I've got a couple questions pertaining to what you said. 1. Given that policy follows culture (this is historically verifiable, but I'm still open to discuss differing opinions on it), and given that our culture is becoming increasingly more hostile towards Christianity, at what point would you think a response of this type would be justified? I mean, what action/s have to take place, if any, before a righteous indignation is warranted. Yes, things here are not even in the same ballpark as they were in Poland during WWII. However, folks didn't just wake up one day to the level of tyranny that we study about in school. It started with a certain level of infringement and snowballed.

Just FYI...I have not watched the other videos yet as I am wanting to approach the OP as a singular event because I think some of the topics that have come from carry good points of consideration.

Side note***I think it's important to remember that many people will feel differently about things than we do personally and I don't think we should be upset at someone for not feeling the same way about something that we do, with certain exceptions and degrees of those exceptions.***

Hope you are settled peacefully soon, bud.
"No reserves, no retreats, no regrets."
"When you're dumb, you've got to be tough." - my dad

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Del
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Re: Really angry pastor in the news

Post by Del » Mon Apr 05, 2021 9:39 pm

durangopipe wrote:
Mon Apr 05, 2021 8:48 pm
My wife is in public health. She sometimes cries herself to sleep precisely because of theses kinds of Ill-informed arguments that are fed by conspiracy theories and political divisions that are utterly unrelated to the actual public health issues and fueled by paranoid people who have spent too much time staring into the dark hole of radical left- and radical right-wing social media and unreliable news sources.
We have a young friend in our Chesterton Society who works for public health. (FYI - I think 31 years old is "young")

She is fiercely disappointed in the state of public health.... not because people are paranoid, but because the public health experts were so inept. You know what she means..... starting with the bogus models that didn't pan out, then letting the politicians take over "what the science says," etc.

Now politicians are talking about "vaccine passports."

The credibility of "Public Health" is wasted. Which is very sad, because there might actually be a dangerous pandemic some day soon.

And for healthcare workers on the front lines, caring for sick people and protecting vulnerable folks.... it sucks.
Last edited by Del on Mon Apr 05, 2021 10:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.
G.K. Chesterton — 'It is terrible to contemplate how few politicians are hanged.'

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wosbald
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Re: Really angry pastor in the news

Post by wosbald » Mon Apr 05, 2021 10:03 pm

+JMJ+

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"[T]he emergency of irregular migration has to be met with justice, solidarity and mercy. Forms of collective expulsion, which do not allow for the suitable treatment of individual cases, are unacceptable."
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JMG
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Re: Really angry pastor in the news

Post by JMG » Mon Apr 05, 2021 10:10 pm

wosbald wrote:
Mon Apr 05, 2021 10:03 pm
+JMJ+

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I like this thing.
"No reserves, no retreats, no regrets."
"When you're dumb, you've got to be tough." - my dad

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