Bob's Chocolate Flake

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ReverendThom
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Re: Bob's Chocolate Flake

Post by ReverendThom » Mon Aug 07, 2017 7:49 am

Funny, the more I look at other places, the more I see the specific term, "Grandma's perfume" for those of us who do not enjoy it.
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Re: Bob's Chocolate Flake

Post by DepartedLight » Mon Aug 07, 2017 7:55 am

ReverendThom wrote:
Mon Aug 07, 2017 7:49 am
Funny, the more I look at other places, the more I see the specific term, "Grandma's perfume" for those of us who do not enjoy it.
Mine was Ennerdale.

Smells like Play-Dough to me.

I like Uncle Bob'c Choco over just plain ol' Bob's Choco.
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Re: Bob's Chocolate Flake

Post by Del » Mon Aug 07, 2017 8:07 am

Rusty wrote:
Sun Aug 06, 2017 4:02 pm
Del wrote:
Sun Aug 06, 2017 3:39 pm
Rusty wrote:
Sun Aug 06, 2017 3:29 pm
Del wrote:
Sun Aug 06, 2017 3:19 pm
Tobacco Reviews lists 22 mentions of "perfume."

http://www.tobaccoreviews.com/blend/553 ... late-flake
Since you're looking up other opinions I gather that you (Del) have not tried it.

208 reviews. The one's that say it's perfume are in the minority.

They also seem to suggest that for them there is one common Lake District flavouring or topping so flavour differentiation is not the same across the two groups because that is certainly not the case for me and others. If you read the reviews of other GH flavoured Lake District flakes the same polarized reviews from the two groups are also present. Check out Scotch Flake, for example.

Blend Description.
The main characteristics of this flake come from the 8% latakia included in the blend and the smooth chocolate aroma. Brazilian, Zimbabwe, Malawi Virginia leaf make up 82% of the blend providing a mild/medium smoke cooled with the addition of 8% Malawi sun cured and 2% Malawi burley. The latakia cools but does also add strength and aroma. The cocoa casings and chocolate top flavors are rounded off with vanillas and other flavors providing sweet notes.
I enjoyed Samuel Gawith's Chocolate Flake.

And I enjoy GH&Co's perfumed blends on occasion.

But I don't recall ever smoking Bob's Chocolate Flake.
You're biasing language by adding the word perfume. But you have a real skill at biasing messages. And I've told you this before.
Do any of the GH tobaccos taste like Grandma's perfume to you?
As I do not have any Bob's Chocolate Flake on hand, I did a search of the reviews online.

As you noted, a small sub-set of the reviewers complained about the characteristic Lake District scent.

This is interesting.

Could be a variation among smokers as to how we perceive the flavor.

Could be some occasional cross-contamination with Ennerdale production at the factory.

I've smoked Ennerdale, Condor, and other perfume-scented blends.
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Re: Bob's Chocolate Flake

Post by Rusty » Mon Aug 07, 2017 9:22 am

JudgeRusty wrote:
Sun Aug 06, 2017 5:50 pm
:wavey:




Other euphemisms besides perfume are "floral," "scented" and "soapy."
Yep. Scented goes without saying. But floral and or soapy is present in many of these. So the scents that North Americans normally associate with bathroom and personal products appear in some of their tobaccos. It seems to be true. And if you associate that flavour spectrum with grandma's perfume then I do understand. Not all of them are soapy or have bathroom product flavours but they are a different flavour palette. Erinmore is/was soapy - one part Juicy fruit gum concentrate, one part licorice, and one part soap. That's what it seems like at first. It's delicious to me and it was strange the first time. I will admit that I spent a lot of my childhood with soap in my mouth. But why on earth would anyone like that? It's an acquired taste. It didn't repel me even though it was strange and very rich tasting. That kind of reaction will lead to enjoying the tobacco time after time.

There is a BCF review that proposes that what I call a sort of non-specific liqueur flavour is similar to the scent of play-doh. I think that's pretty close. It is a bit like the scent of play-doh. After smoking BCF for a while (ie successive bowls) that play-doh scent sort of drops away and I do sense that the flavour is sort of like chocolate. But coming back to it after not smoking it and the play-doh is there again for a while. So I wonder how many grandma's wear play-doh scent as a perfume?

The real puzzle is why wouldn't the Brits just hit us over the head with chocolate like the Americans would? Dunno. But thank goodness there are different approaches to flavouring because for the most part I don't like the American aromatics.
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Re: Bob's Chocolate Flake

Post by Rusty » Mon Aug 07, 2017 9:47 am

Del wrote:
Mon Aug 07, 2017 8:07 am
Rusty wrote:
Sun Aug 06, 2017 4:02 pm
Del wrote:
Sun Aug 06, 2017 3:39 pm
Rusty wrote:
Sun Aug 06, 2017 3:29 pm
Del wrote:
Sun Aug 06, 2017 3:19 pm
Tobacco Reviews lists 22 mentions of "perfume."

http://www.tobaccoreviews.com/blend/553 ... late-flake
Since you're looking up other opinions I gather that you (Del) have not tried it.

208 reviews. The one's that say it's perfume are in the minority.

They also seem to suggest that for them there is one common Lake District flavouring or topping so flavour differentiation is not the same across the two groups because that is certainly not the case for me and others. If you read the reviews of other GH flavoured Lake District flakes the same polarized reviews from the two groups are also present. Check out Scotch Flake, for example.

Blend Description.
The main characteristics of this flake come from the 8% latakia included in the blend and the smooth chocolate aroma. Brazilian, Zimbabwe, Malawi Virginia leaf make up 82% of the blend providing a mild/medium smoke cooled with the addition of 8% Malawi sun cured and 2% Malawi burley. The latakia cools but does also add strength and aroma. The cocoa casings and chocolate top flavors are rounded off with vanillas and other flavors providing sweet notes.
I enjoyed Samuel Gawith's Chocolate Flake.

And I enjoy GH&Co's perfumed blends on occasion.

But I don't recall ever smoking Bob's Chocolate Flake.
You're biasing language by adding the word perfume. But you have a real skill at biasing messages. And I've told you this before.
Do any of the GH tobaccos taste like Grandma's perfume to you?
As I do not have any Bob's Chocolate Flake on hand, I did a search of the reviews online.

As you noted, a small sub-set of the reviewers complained about the characteristic Lake District scent.
Yes, I note that people think there is one characteristic scent. It's sometimes called "lakeland essence" as if there is one bottle that they liberally spray on all tobaccos. It's isn't one scent for me at all. They're each distinct & different from each other. So this idea that there is one characteristic scent strikes me as wrong. But there is a palette or style to their flavourings.
Del wrote:
Mon Aug 07, 2017 8:07 am
This is interesting.

Could be a variation among smokers as to how we perceive the flavor.
Something like this appears to be the case.
Del wrote:
Mon Aug 07, 2017 8:07 am
Could be some occasional cross-contamination with Ennerdale production at the factory.

I've smoked Ennerdale, Condor, and other perfume-scented blends.
A GH description of the Ennerdale flavourings:
Our best selling flake by a wide margin. Predominately virginia leaf from Brazil, Zimbabwe and Malawi (86%) but with the addition of sun cured Malawi (10%) to add sweetness, strength and to cool the smoke and Malawi Burley (4%) to "carry the flavour" in addition to its cooling and strength qualities. (Burley is very good at absorbing casings and flavours) A background flavour of Almond is enhanced with the addition of fruit flavours, vanilla, and the special 'English type' flavours which give this tobacco its distinctive, yet typical 'English' Aroma associated with the UK best selling brands such as Condor, St Bruno and mellow virginia.
Here is the GH description of Kendal flake:
A stronger tobacco with light side proportions of 68% virginia and a dark side of nearly 1/3, including 16% dark-cured Indian leaf, provide a medium strength smoke. The dominant flavour is one of scented almond and this complex top note is achieved by the combination of over 10 different flavours, including Rose Geranium, Vanilla, Rum, Tanquid, Musk, Heliotropin and Rose Fragrances.
You can see floral toppings mentioned plainly. Kendal flake has a very complex flavour. It's quite different than Ennerdale.

Here's a GH description of Bosun Cut Plug which is dominated by cloves with other complex flavours in the background.
With only slightly over 50% (54%) flue-cured virginias from Brazil, Zimbabwe and Malawi and 31% dark fired leaf this is a fairly strong smoke. The addition of some sweeter sun cured leaf from Malawi and the rich cigar type notes from the dark air cured Indian grade help to sound off the blend. The special Virginia casings complement the top notes derived from the addition of sharper flavours including oil of cloves and rose geranium.
For some of you these are all unalterably Grandma's perfume. That's ok there are plenty of other tobaccos on the market.
The idea that you need to persevere with tobaccos that you don't like to acquire a taste for it is really odd. Why would you feel compelled to do that?
Last edited by Rusty on Mon Aug 07, 2017 10:09 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Bob's Chocolate Flake

Post by sweetandsour » Mon Aug 07, 2017 10:08 am

Never had BCF, but I did the same thing, ordering more than just sample size, with Russ Monthly Blend Candy Cane Coco.
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Re: Bob's Chocolate Flake

Post by Rusty » Mon Aug 07, 2017 10:19 am

sweetandsour wrote:
Mon Aug 07, 2017 10:08 am
Never had BCF, but I did the same thing, ordering more than just sample size, with Russ Monthly Blend Candy Cane Coco.
BCF was the first GH tobacco I tried. I thought it was great. I went on buying sample sizes of some others and loved them. So I didn't bother with the sample sizes anymore. I started buying 500g bulk boxes, without having even tasted them, so confident was I that I would love them. They never let me down. Every one was wonderful. I would smoke every new one while I was packing the rest away in jars. But they really are best new. Cellar time beyond a year or so erodes away the toppings on many. And they're not nearly as interesting without the toppings. While the scented ones will 'ghost' the pipe it doesn't last. I always enjoyed the crossover from any GH scented tobacco to my McClelland Virginias but unfortunately it doesn't persist beyond a bowl or two. With Erinmore and Condor the flavour in your pipe is much more permanent and that is true with the toppings on the tobacco in a cellar too. They really last. I like the crossover from Erinmore to McClelland Virginias too, and it's good thing I do. But most of the toppings on GH scented tobaccos fade away with time.

BCF, btw, doesn't change much with age. At 10 yo it is still very much the same. So that one behaves differently under cellar aging than the others for some odd reason.
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Re: Bob's Chocolate Flake

Post by hugodrax » Mon Aug 07, 2017 10:46 am

Rusty wrote:
Mon Aug 07, 2017 10:19 am
sweetandsour wrote:
Mon Aug 07, 2017 10:08 am
Never had BCF, but I did the same thing, ordering more than just sample size, with Russ Monthly Blend Candy Cane Coco.
BCF was the first GH tobacco I tried. I thought it was great. I went on buying sample sizes of some others and loved them. So I didn't bother with the sample sizes anymore. I started buying 500g bulk boxes, without having even tasted them, so confident was I that I would love them. They never let me down. Every one was wonderful. But they really are best new. Cellar time beyond a year or so erodes away the toppings on many. And they're not nearly as interesting without the toppings. While the scented ones will 'ghost' the pipe it doesn't last. I always enjoyed the crossover from any GH scented tobacco to my McClelland Virginias but unfortunately it doesn't persist beyond a bowl or two. With Erinmore and Condor the flavour in your pipe is much more permanent and that is true with the toppings on the tobacco in a cellar too. They really last. I like the crossover from Erinmore to McClelland Virginias too, and it's good thing I do. But most of the toppings on GH scented tobaccos fade away with time.
Remember me, O Rusty of the North, when thou lookest to divest thyself of tobaccos and pipes and the materials thereof, for I, in my own small way, echoest thine experiences and tastes. De gustibus non disputandem est, sayeth the Roman, but they who tasteth perfume and not the wondrous aromatics of the Orient in the tobaccos of the Gawiths are truly an abomination in the sight of the Pipeman, and their portion shall be the hay, the grass, and the nicotinuous paucity of the tobaccos of the faded Norsemen. Oggier is dead, and shall not come again.

Yea, Prince Albert shall be their portion, and they shall say it is goodly meat, but meat without salt sustaineth not the life of men. They shall claim kinsmen with their heroes, and smoke the Golden Calf of Capstan, or worship the Baal of Three Nuns, such is their iniquity. Their pipes shall gurgle and sour, and they will not heed the warning wherein salvation and comfort both may be found: Best Brown healeth the burned tongue, salves the hearts of men, and promoteth pure living.

Oh, and I want some Erinmore, too.
Etiam mihi opinio anserem perirent.

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Re: Bob's Chocolate Flake

Post by Rusty » Mon Aug 07, 2017 12:28 pm

hugodrax wrote:
Mon Aug 07, 2017 10:46 am
Rusty wrote:
Mon Aug 07, 2017 10:19 am
sweetandsour wrote:
Mon Aug 07, 2017 10:08 am
Never had BCF, but I did the same thing, ordering more than just sample size, with Russ Monthly Blend Candy Cane Coco.
BCF was the first GH tobacco I tried. I thought it was great. I went on buying sample sizes of some others and loved them. So I didn't bother with the sample sizes anymore. I started buying 500g bulk boxes, without having even tasted them, so confident was I that I would love them. They never let me down. Every one was wonderful. But they really are best new. Cellar time beyond a year or so erodes away the toppings on many. And they're not nearly as interesting without the toppings. While the scented ones will 'ghost' the pipe it doesn't last. I always enjoyed the crossover from any GH scented tobacco to my McClelland Virginias but unfortunately it doesn't persist beyond a bowl or two. With Erinmore and Condor the flavour in your pipe is much more permanent and that is true with the toppings on the tobacco in a cellar too. They really last. I like the crossover from Erinmore to McClelland Virginias too, and it's good thing I do. But most of the toppings on GH scented tobaccos fade away with time.
Remember me, O Rusty of the North, when thou lookest to divest thyself of tobaccos and pipes and the materials thereof, for I, in my own small way, echoest thine experiences and tastes. De gustibus non disputandem est, sayeth the Roman, but they who tasteth perfume and not the wondrous aromatics of the Orient in the tobaccos of the Gawiths are truly an abomination in the sight of the Pipeman, and their portion shall be the hay, the grass, and the nicotinuous paucity of the tobaccos of the faded Norsemen. Oggier is dead, and shall not come again.

Yea, Prince Albert shall be their portion, and they shall say it is goodly meat, but meat without salt sustaineth not the life of men. They shall claim kinsmen with their heroes, and smoke the Golden Calf of Capstan, or worship the Baal of Three Nuns, such is their iniquity. Their pipes shall gurgle and sour, and they will not heed the warning wherein salvation and comfort both may be found: Best Brown healeth the burned tongue, salves the hearts of men, and promoteth pure living.

Oh, and I want some Erinmore, too.
Did I ever tell you the story of the three pigs? You remind me of the first little pig.

I'm a little jealous because you decided that the market is your cellar and you buy as you need. This is a much better deal financially than investing in a cellar and paying up front with all the downside losses. But it doesn't work with tobaccos that have been effectively discontinued. Once they're gone they're gone. Only the visionary, paranoid, type 3 piggies will invest to offset the loss.

What were you thinking when BAT announced in fall 2004 that they were closing Murrays and outsource manufacturing?
I'm really curious. It came out and was discussed on ASP in Nov. 2004. Any sober guesses put the tobaccos in the Dane's hands. Who else was there? So when it all ended up in STG that was not a surprise. And we knew what it meant. That BAT disposed of all but one brand in 2007 selling it to STG was a shock. The Danes were free any constraints. Holy moly!

As a guiding principle I assumed that EVERYTHING that Murray's made would be discontinued or changed so much that it was effectively discontinued. That has happened. And, worst case, I presumed it might happen very quickly. The most extreme assumption was not daring or unrealistic because the manufacturers were still pruning products ie the market was still shrinking. Remember that?

So I sat down in December 2004 and made a list of everything they made and assigned weights (amounts) to each one. Then I began buying them. This was forever - the last buys. The vision was that the output of Murrays Belfast was coming to me. But because of where I am it had to be small orders. Many of them. This is typical type 3 pig behaviour. They see big bad wolves everywhere. But a river of boxes flows through it.

That went on for three years, two more than I anticipated, because Murrays loaded the supply chain before they closed. And it took me a long time to empty it. So Erinmore Flake made by Murrays remained available from any US retailer, in pretty much any any amount all through 2005, 2006, and right into 2007. I couldn't believe it. But of course the other nuts were all after Dunhill blends and left the Erinmore. I will admit that I encouraged them. I watched as news of Murrays manufacturing buildings being torn down hit the Belfast news and then the entire site was sold in November 2005. Then, horror of horrors, they turned Paradise into a parking lot. Really! It became a metered parking lot with monthly rates. It was clear evidence that the big bad wolf was real. He ate the gd tobacco manufacturing plant and then desecrated the site!!!! Oh my. This motivates.

So for three years (2005, 2006, & 2007) after the news you danced and drank and smoked in bliss. WTF were you thinking? The big bad wolf was about in the world. And now 12 years! later you're looking for what????!!!!
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Re: Bob's Chocolate Flake

Post by Goose55 » Wed Aug 09, 2017 5:29 pm

ReverendThom wrote:
Sun Aug 06, 2017 12:27 pm
I ordered 4oz of this from smoking pipes and it arrived the day after my daughter's birth. I have been smoking a lot of flake cuts lately, and was excited to try this one out.
Today I packed a light bowl in one of my favourite homemade pipes and excitedly went out to the garage to do some work and enjoy a nice cup of dark roast and a smoke.
It lit up nicely, though I wondered on packing if I should have dried it a little.
Upon my first real puff I sat to savour the flavour of chocolate.
...
Perfume.
It tastes like perfume.
It tastes like my grandmother's perfume.
I have 4oz of my grandmother's perfume sitting in my cellar now.
What the deuce? Will I acquire a taste for perfume in my pipe?
I also feel like this will ghost the crap out of any pipe it's smoked in, yes?
What is the perfume taste? And where is the chocolate???? Image
I give Bob's Chocolate Flake 3 poop emojis out of ten stars right now. ImageImageImage
I'm not sure why I ordered so much of something I've never previously tried but I will not be doing that again.

Sent from my SM-G935W8 using Tapatalk
Just had a bowl of Gawith, Hoggarth, & Co. bulk Bob's Chocolate Flake, in an old, craggy bent Stanwell, and it was good.
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Re: Bob's Chocolate Flake

Post by hugodrax » Wed Aug 09, 2017 7:52 pm

Rusty wrote:
Mon Aug 07, 2017 12:28 pm
hugodrax wrote:
Mon Aug 07, 2017 10:46 am
Rusty wrote:
Mon Aug 07, 2017 10:19 am
sweetandsour wrote:
Mon Aug 07, 2017 10:08 am
Never had BCF, but I did the same thing, ordering more than just sample size, with Russ Monthly Blend Candy Cane Coco.
BCF was the first GH tobacco I tried. I thought it was great. I went on buying sample sizes of some others and loved them. So I didn't bother with the sample sizes anymore. I started buying 500g bulk boxes, without having even tasted them, so confident was I that I would love them. They never let me down. Every one was wonderful. But they really are best new. Cellar time beyond a year or so erodes away the toppings on many. And they're not nearly as interesting without the toppings. While the scented ones will 'ghost' the pipe it doesn't last. I always enjoyed the crossover from any GH scented tobacco to my McClelland Virginias but unfortunately it doesn't persist beyond a bowl or two. With Erinmore and Condor the flavour in your pipe is much more permanent and that is true with the toppings on the tobacco in a cellar too. They really last. I like the crossover from Erinmore to McClelland Virginias too, and it's good thing I do. But most of the toppings on GH scented tobaccos fade away with time.
Remember me, O Rusty of the North, when thou lookest to divest thyself of tobaccos and pipes and the materials thereof, for I, in my own small way, echoest thine experiences and tastes. De gustibus non disputandem est, sayeth the Roman, but they who tasteth perfume and not the wondrous aromatics of the Orient in the tobaccos of the Gawiths are truly an abomination in the sight of the Pipeman, and their portion shall be the hay, the grass, and the nicotinuous paucity of the tobaccos of the faded Norsemen. Oggier is dead, and shall not come again.

Yea, Prince Albert shall be their portion, and they shall say it is goodly meat, but meat without salt sustaineth not the life of men. They shall claim kinsmen with their heroes, and smoke the Golden Calf of Capstan, or worship the Baal of Three Nuns, such is their iniquity. Their pipes shall gurgle and sour, and they will not heed the warning wherein salvation and comfort both may be found: Best Brown healeth the burned tongue, salves the hearts of men, and promoteth pure living.

Oh, and I want some Erinmore, too.
Did I ever tell you the story of the three pigs? You remind me of the first little pig.

I'm a little jealous because you decided that the market is your cellar and you buy as you need. This is a much better deal financially than investing in a cellar and paying up front with all the downside losses. But it doesn't work with tobaccos that have been effectively discontinued. Once they're gone they're gone. Only the visionary, paranoid, type 3 piggies will invest to offset the loss.

What were you thinking when BAT announced in fall 2004 that they were closing Murrays and outsource manufacturing?
I'm really curious. It came out and was discussed on ASP in Nov. 2004. Any sober guesses put the tobaccos in the Dane's hands. Who else was there? So when it all ended up in STG that was not a surprise. And we knew what it meant. That BAT disposed of all but one brand in 2007 selling it to STG was a shock. The Danes were free any constraints. Holy moly!

As a guiding principle I assumed that EVERYTHING that Murray's made would be discontinued or changed so much that it was effectively discontinued. That has happened. And, worst case, I presumed it might happen very quickly. The most extreme assumption was not daring or unrealistic because the manufacturers were still pruning products ie the market was still shrinking. Remember that?

So I sat down in December 2004 and made a list of everything they made and assigned weights (amounts) to each one. Then I began buying them. This was forever - the last buys. The vision was that the output of Murrays Belfast was coming to me. But because of where I am it had to be small orders. Many of them. This is typical type 3 pig behaviour. They see big bad wolves everywhere. But a river of boxes flows through it.

That went on for three years, two more than I anticipated, because Murrays loaded the supply chain before they closed. And it took me a long time to empty it. So Erinmore Flake made by Murrays remained available from any US retailer, in pretty much any any amount all through 2005, 2006, and right into 2007. I couldn't believe it. But of course the other nuts were all after Dunhill blends and left the Erinmore. I will admit that I encouraged them. I watched as news of Murrays manufacturing buildings being torn down hit the Belfast news and then the entire site was sold in November 2005. Then, horror of horrors, they turned Paradise into a parking lot. Really! It became a metered parking lot with monthly rates. It was clear evidence that the big bad wolf was real. He ate the gd tobacco manufacturing plant and then desecrated the site!!!! Oh my. This motivates.

So for three years (2005, 2006, & 2007) after the news you danced and drank and smoked in bliss. WTF were you thinking? The big bad wolf was about in the world. And now 12 years! later you're looking for what????!!!!
So much punctuation.

Honestly, I expected it to change, but not so drastically. I didn't forsee it becoming African virginia free. I believed it would change but slightly, and I was wrong.

But things change and loss is a part of life. One is saddened for a while, but adaptation occurs. I smoke more Bosun's Cut Plug now. Part of my refusal to cellar these days us an attempt to fight my own analysis tendencies, to be honest.

And I did squirrel away tins of what I believed aged well--Wessex Curly and Astleys 44, for the most part. I survived and have learned to enjoy other tobaccos.

And we should look on the brighter side, yes? Murrays Dunhill was, to me, crapola. It's much better now. I'm curious to try the K und K version of Erinmore. Might be a new friend. And I've learned to really enjoy McClelland tobaccos. So I believe I've been given more than has been taken away.

Now, to the rat bastard that lifted my old Dunhill pouch last night thinking it was a wallet, I curse him. That's a friend of 20 odd years acquaintance. I bought a ten dollar roll up today, and my left hip pocket could tell the difference.
Etiam mihi opinio anserem perirent.

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Re: Bob's Chocolate Flake

Post by Rusty » Wed Aug 09, 2017 8:28 pm

hugodrax wrote:
Wed Aug 09, 2017 7:52 pm
Rusty wrote:
Mon Aug 07, 2017 12:28 pm
hugodrax wrote:
Mon Aug 07, 2017 10:46 am
Rusty wrote:
Mon Aug 07, 2017 10:19 am
sweetandsour wrote:
Mon Aug 07, 2017 10:08 am
Never had BCF, but I did the same thing, ordering more than just sample size, with Russ Monthly Blend Candy Cane Coco.
BCF was the first GH tobacco I tried. I thought it was great. I went on buying sample sizes of some others and loved them. So I didn't bother with the sample sizes anymore. I started buying 500g bulk boxes, without having even tasted them, so confident was I that I would love them. They never let me down. Every one was wonderful. But they really are best new. Cellar time beyond a year or so erodes away the toppings on many. And they're not nearly as interesting without the toppings. While the scented ones will 'ghost' the pipe it doesn't last. I always enjoyed the crossover from any GH scented tobacco to my McClelland Virginias but unfortunately it doesn't persist beyond a bowl or two. With Erinmore and Condor the flavour in your pipe is much more permanent and that is true with the toppings on the tobacco in a cellar too. They really last. I like the crossover from Erinmore to McClelland Virginias too, and it's good thing I do. But most of the toppings on GH scented tobaccos fade away with time.
Remember me, O Rusty of the North, when thou lookest to divest thyself of tobaccos and pipes and the materials thereof, for I, in my own small way, echoest thine experiences and tastes. De gustibus non disputandem est, sayeth the Roman, but they who tasteth perfume and not the wondrous aromatics of the Orient in the tobaccos of the Gawiths are truly an abomination in the sight of the Pipeman, and their portion shall be the hay, the grass, and the nicotinuous paucity of the tobaccos of the faded Norsemen. Oggier is dead, and shall not come again.

Yea, Prince Albert shall be their portion, and they shall say it is goodly meat, but meat without salt sustaineth not the life of men. They shall claim kinsmen with their heroes, and smoke the Golden Calf of Capstan, or worship the Baal of Three Nuns, such is their iniquity. Their pipes shall gurgle and sour, and they will not heed the warning wherein salvation and comfort both may be found: Best Brown healeth the burned tongue, salves the hearts of men, and promoteth pure living.

Oh, and I want some Erinmore, too.
Did I ever tell you the story of the three pigs? You remind me of the first little pig.

I'm a little jealous because you decided that the market is your cellar and you buy as you need. This is a much better deal financially than investing in a cellar and paying up front with all the downside losses. But it doesn't work with tobaccos that have been effectively discontinued. Once they're gone they're gone. Only the visionary, paranoid, type 3 piggies will invest to offset the loss.

What were you thinking when BAT announced in fall 2004 that they were closing Murrays and outsource manufacturing?
I'm really curious. It came out and was discussed on ASP in Nov. 2004. Any sober guesses put the tobaccos in the Dane's hands. Who else was there? So when it all ended up in STG that was not a surprise. And we knew what it meant. That BAT disposed of all but one brand in 2007 selling it to STG was a shock. The Danes were free any constraints. Holy moly!

As a guiding principle I assumed that EVERYTHING that Murray's made would be discontinued or changed so much that it was effectively discontinued. That has happened. And, worst case, I presumed it might happen very quickly. The most extreme assumption was not daring or unrealistic because the manufacturers were still pruning products ie the market was still shrinking. Remember that?

So I sat down in December 2004 and made a list of everything they made and assigned weights (amounts) to each one. Then I began buying them. This was forever - the last buys. The vision was that the output of Murrays Belfast was coming to me. But because of where I am it had to be small orders. Many of them. This is typical type 3 pig behaviour. They see big bad wolves everywhere. But a river of boxes flows through it.

That went on for three years, two more than I anticipated, because Murrays loaded the supply chain before they closed. And it took me a long time to empty it. So Erinmore Flake made by Murrays remained available from any US retailer, in pretty much any any amount all through 2005, 2006, and right into 2007. I couldn't believe it. But of course the other nuts were all after Dunhill blends and left the Erinmore. I will admit that I encouraged them. I watched as news of Murrays manufacturing buildings being torn down hit the Belfast news and then the entire site was sold in November 2005. Then, horror of horrors, they turned Paradise into a parking lot. Really! It became a metered parking lot with monthly rates. It was clear evidence that the big bad wolf was real. He ate the gd tobacco manufacturing plant and then desecrated the site!!!! Oh my. This motivates.

So for three years (2005, 2006, & 2007) after the news you danced and drank and smoked in bliss. WTF were you thinking? The big bad wolf was about in the world. And now 12 years! later you're looking for what????!!!!
So much punctuation.

Honestly, I expected it to change, but not so drastically. I didn't forsee it becoming African virginia free. I believed it would change but slightly, and I was wrong.
Such a good sport. This is classic type 1 piggy optimism. I've seen it before. The wolf is Jewish and won't eat pigs. Oh yes he will. We knew it would be bad because we experienced the result of the export Imperial flakes going to STG. Smokers howled. It isn't even that this is the best and closest that the Dane's can get with an intention to match the original. They don't do that. They change it to make it a Danish tobacco. It's a kind of virulent tobacco nationalism. In this case we were confused at first because the first tins looked like it was a very close duplication. But the later product proved that wrong. I now think they had Murray's manufactured tobacco stock in new tins at the very beginning. It didn't last.
hugodrax wrote:
Wed Aug 09, 2017 7:52 pm
But things change and loss is a part of life. One is saddened for a while, but adaptation occurs. I smoke more Bosun's Cut Plug now. Part of my refusal to cellar these days us an attempt to fight my own analysis tendencies, to be honest.
Uh huh. So you're happy without the dear old tart.
hugodrax wrote:
Wed Aug 09, 2017 7:52 pm
And I did squirrel away tins of what I believed aged well--Wessex Curly and Astleys 44, for the most part. I survived and have learned to enjoy other tobaccos.

And we should look on the brighter side, yes? Murrays Dunhill was, to me, crapola. It's much better now. I'm curious to try the K und K version of Erinmore. Might be a new friend. And I've learned to really enjoy McClelland tobaccos. So I believe I've been given more than has been taken away.
You're right about the Dunhill mixtures. They really were an announcement of much worse to come in the 80's. Awful.
Is there news? STG acquired the Erinmore TM, recipes etc. Lock, stock, and barrel. Feb. 2007. It isn't a licensing arrangement out of BAT. BAT disposed of it among many others. I think Erinmore was the crown jewel because it had a good sized market and it always has had. Orlik/STG acked that in their announcement. So what is the connection to KK? KK Erinmore? Is this fever? Also both Wessex and Astley's were made by McConnell back before 1990. After that it went to the Germans and they're pretty clear on the recipes being their assets anyway. So which tins did you put away? I thought the KK Wessex Curly Cut was very good. Correction, is very good, I still have some.
hugodrax wrote:
Wed Aug 09, 2017 7:52 pm
Now, to the rat bastard that lifted my old Dunhill pouch last night thinking it was a wallet, I curse him. That's a friend of 20 odd years acquaintance. I bought a ten dollar roll up today, and my left hip pocket could tell the difference.
He probably thought it had Erinmore in it. He likely trashed it in disappointment. He's probably a fallen type 1 piggy. No moral guidance at all. And why should he with all the tobacco lies present.
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You're out of the dark
You're out of the night
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Re: Bob's Chocolate Flake

Post by hugodrax » Thu Aug 10, 2017 2:08 am

Not sure the 3 pigs analogy is spot on, but I get it. I don't think I'm quite as devil may care as your characterization. I'm fairly omnivorous when it comes to tobacco. My way has seen a few old friends go away, but I've also made new ones. They'll probably go as well.

I'm spoiled because I live about 5 miles away from a top tier little shop, where the owners know me and make sure I get what I like. They won't let me buy a tobacco they know I'd dislike. So that probably has something to do with it, too.

When I was cellaring, so to speak, I put down only what I thought would work. Marlin Flake. Astley's 44 and 88. Fribourg & Treyer. Wessex Curly. Dunhill Light Flake. I didn't think to get the Erin more Flake. I regret that. But I didn't think it would cellar well, either. So I was wrong there, too.

I'm also 39 years old, sir. I cannot feasibly cellar tobacco and raise my family. I figure even with my reprobate lifestyle, I should have a few decades left. How do you cellar for thirty-odd years? I can't. So I have to make allowances for certain things just going away. I refuse to chase unobtainable tobacco. Would I love to have the old No. 10? Yes, but I'm happy with Key Largo, too.

But I freely and totally admit to being wrong about Erinmore. I should have put that away.
Etiam mihi opinio anserem perirent.

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Re: Bob's Chocolate Flake

Post by Del » Thu Aug 10, 2017 11:02 am

I smoked a bowl of aged Ennerdale for breakfast this morning.

While I am "aware" of the perfume topping, it doesn't show up in the taste much -- at least for me. I taste virginia.

But the lingering aftertaste is refreshingly different from American tobaccos. Kinda minty.

Now I'm curious about Bob's Chocolate Flake.

In general, Lake District tobaccos seem to be very polarizing. You either like them or you can't. On Tobacco Reviews, Ennerdale has mostly 4-star ratings, but about a quarter score just one star.
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Re: Bob's Chocolate Flake

Post by Cleon » Thu Aug 10, 2017 11:58 am

DepartedLight wrote:
Mon Aug 07, 2017 7:55 am
ReverendThom wrote:
Mon Aug 07, 2017 7:49 am
Funny, the more I look at other places, the more I see the specific term, "Grandma's perfume" for those of us who do not enjoy it.
Mine was Ennerdale.

Smells like Play-Dough to me.

I like Uncle Bob'c Choco over just plain ol' Bob's Choco.
Like Rusty said, it's supposed to be almonds. Whatever. Play-doh will do. I love the stuff.

I don't think any of the Lake District stuff I've tried even came close to tasting or smelling like what they say they are topped with. For instance, I think it was Bosun Cut Plug that was supposed to be clove flavored. I got some fully expecting some clove twang, but nothin'.
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Re: Bob's Chocolate Flake

Post by Del » Thu Aug 10, 2017 12:09 pm

Cleon wrote:
Thu Aug 10, 2017 11:58 am
DepartedLight wrote:
Mon Aug 07, 2017 7:55 am
ReverendThom wrote:
Mon Aug 07, 2017 7:49 am
Funny, the more I look at other places, the more I see the specific term, "Grandma's perfume" for those of us who do not enjoy it.
Mine was Ennerdale.

Smells like Play-Dough to me.

I like Uncle Bob'c Choco over just plain ol' Bob's Choco.
Like Rusty said, it's supposed to be almonds. Whatever. Play-doh will do. I love the stuff.

I don't think any of the Lake District stuff I've tried even came close to tasting or smelling like what they say they are topped with. For instance, I think it was Bosun Cut Plug that was supposed to be clove flavored. I got some fully expecting some clove twang, but nothin'.
I tried a sample once.... Tasted like clove. I hate clove.
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Re: Bob's Chocolate Flake

Post by Irish-Dane » Mon Oct 16, 2017 6:40 pm

I've been on a more than usual pipe smoking binge the last couple weeks. My usual 3-4 bowls a week has turned into 2-3 a night. I haven't smoked that much since I was single man living back in the Log House. It's no Rusty or Morley pace, sure, but it's been an enjoyable few weeks. All that to say... I had a hankering for something new. And then I remembered I had one tin of Bob's Chocolate Flake I had purchased in 2006. I let the Missus crack the seal and take the first scent. While she was trying to figure it out, I pulled up this thread to give it a read.

First fear reading this thread? Oh great, another Lakeland laced tobacco. First inhale of the tobacco aromas? Zero soapy, perfumed, or any other negative I hated so much about other "lakeland" styles. Also, no chocolate. I must admit there's a little sadness in the last one. Oh well.

I'm smoking it in the unsmoked Green, one-knuckle bamboo, green cumberland stemmed Rhox pipe that JMG made right before he left for the jungle this last time. He hand delivered the pipe to me while we had dinner together here in my hometown as his family rolled through town. He tried to give it to me but I "donated" some money to his Mission society.

BCF lights easily and smokes well in this pipe. Like I said, zero perfume or soap, but also no other flavors either. Kind of a dull tobacco. The only thing of note is a good amount of Vitamin-N. I had thoughts only reading this thread I would be offering it to someone for free, but this one will be tried again a few more times before that happens.
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Re: Bob's Chocolate Flake

Post by ReverendThom » Tue Oct 17, 2017 4:53 am

Irish-Dane wrote:
Mon Oct 16, 2017 6:40 pm
I've been on a more than usual pipe smoking binge the last couple weeks. My usual 3-4 bowls a week has turned into 2-3 a night. I haven't smoked that much since I was single man living back in the Log House. It's no Rusty or Morley pace, sure, but it's been an enjoyable few weeks. All that to say... I had a hankering for something new. And then I remembered I had one tin of Bob's Chocolate Flake I had purchased in 2006. I let the Missus crack the seal and take the first scent. While she was trying to figure it out, I pulled up this thread to give it a read.

First fear reading this thread? Oh great, another Lakeland laced tobacco. First inhale of the tobacco aromas? Zero soapy, perfumed, or any other negative I hated so much about other "lakeland" styles. Also, no chocolate. I must admit there's a little sadness in the last one. Oh well.

I'm smoking it in the unsmoked Green, one-knuckle bamboo, green cumberland stemmed Rhox pipe that JMG made right before he left for the jungle this last time. He hand delivered the pipe to me while we had dinner together here in my hometown as his family rolled through town. He tried to give it to me but I "donated" some money to his Mission society.

BCF lights easily and smokes well in this pipe. Like I said, zero perfume or soap, but also no other flavors either. Kind of a dull tobacco. The only thing of note is a good amount of Vitamin-N. I had thoughts only reading this thread I would be offering it to someone for free, but this one will be tried again a few more times before that happens.
So age kills the perfume? Good - I will let mine sit for a decade :P
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Re: Bob's Chocolate Flake

Post by Rusty » Tue Oct 17, 2017 8:47 am

ReverendThom wrote:
Tue Oct 17, 2017 4:53 am
Irish-Dane wrote:
Mon Oct 16, 2017 6:40 pm
I've been on a more than usual pipe smoking binge the last couple weeks. My usual 3-4 bowls a week has turned into 2-3 a night. I haven't smoked that much since I was single man living back in the Log House. It's no Rusty or Morley pace, sure, but it's been an enjoyable few weeks. All that to say... I had a hankering for something new. And then I remembered I had one tin of Bob's Chocolate Flake I had purchased in 2006. I let the Missus crack the seal and take the first scent. While she was trying to figure it out, I pulled up this thread to give it a read.

First fear reading this thread? Oh great, another Lakeland laced tobacco. First inhale of the tobacco aromas? Zero soapy, perfumed, or any other negative I hated so much about other "lakeland" styles. Also, no chocolate. I must admit there's a little sadness in the last one. Oh well.

I'm smoking it in the unsmoked Green, one-knuckle bamboo, green cumberland stemmed Rhox pipe that JMG made right before he left for the jungle this last time. He hand delivered the pipe to me while we had dinner together here in my hometown as his family rolled through town. He tried to give it to me but I "donated" some money to his Mission society.

BCF lights easily and smokes well in this pipe. Like I said, zero perfume or soap, but also no other flavors either. Kind of a dull tobacco. The only thing of note is a good amount of Vitamin-N. I had thoughts only reading this thread I would be offering it to someone for free, but this one will be tried again a few more times before that happens.
So age kills the perfume? Good - I will let mine sit for a decade :P
LOL! ID's perceptions are perfectly valid for him. But I found that BCF retained flavouring out beyond a decade. It was quite noticeably BCF still to my delight. And there was more than one batch involved. In my experience the topping flavours on most of the flavoured GH flakes I smoked is very noticeably attentuated in just a few years of cellar time but not BCF. However I did notice variation with other GH flakes. Some batches lost topping very quickly whereas for other batches of the same product it persisted longer but, other than BCF, at a decade they were pretty bland. BCF is also not very strong and the components tell us that it can't be very strong. At best it's a medium strength.

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Re: Bob's Chocolate Flake

Post by plainview » Tue Oct 17, 2017 9:06 am

I had a puck of TABAC shaving soap - lost and then found in a random bathroom cabinet - that retained its strong, distinctive smell (read, granny's purse like), even after a few years of missing from my rotation.

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