Yeah, we worship Mary. You gotta problem with 'dat?!?

For those deep thinkers out there.

Moderator: tuttle

Post Reply
User avatar
Onyx
Darth Onyx, Bringer of Unity
Darth Onyx, Bringer of Unity
Posts: 10808
Joined: Mon Dec 01, 2008 6:00 pm
Location: Skeptopolis

Post by Onyx » Fri Mar 18, 2011 11:29 pm

CaptainBlack wrote:Before this thread started I was convinced that despite thread started we were united by a common bond in Christ. Yet while that may be true, I leave this thread troubled by all that divides us and a conviction that we have different faiths practiced in the context of vastly different religions. I’ll be praying for you. And I know some of you will be praying for me.
Captain, now that I've read your whole post, I see you've spoken from the heart. I also share your understanding of the state of the differing theologies here. All the pirates and admonitions to be respectful (which I appreciate) do not disguise the fact that the exclusive beliefs expressed are exclusive to each other.

But what do you suggest? If people focus on what unites, then they would simply be ignoring what divides. There is no choice with exclusive beliefs but to think that the alternatives are wrong. I know that some people here are tired of these sorts of threads, and would rather not get into these discussions that seem to go on forever getting nowhere. But even if we didn't talk about it, the divisive beliefs are still there. And some of us (apparently) keep wanting to talk about this stuff.

How does your father accommodate the two sets of beliefs? In my family there are some Catholic and some Protestant. They find no conflict because they don't really give too much credence to the details - rather they take the essence of the gospel of Christ and endeavour to love one another as he loved. It's a bit like Jesus not getting so upset over details of the Sabbath law, but rather being concerned about loving and serving people. And they all seem to agree that our various religious understanding are only approximations of absolute truth. (Now we see through a glass darkly.)

...Then in my family there is also a fundamentalist who thinks she is right and everyone else is wrong. She won't speak to us. That's why I've just about had it with people who think that their theology is the only one with God's stamp of approval.
4. No more signatures that quote other CPS members.
-- Thunktank

User avatar
Thunktank
Terminal Lance. Perpetual Sea Lawyer. Unicorn Aficionado
Terminal Lance.  Perpetual Sea Lawyer. Unicorn Aficionado
Posts: 21449
Joined: Sat Oct 25, 2008 6:00 pm
Location: North Texas

Post by Thunktank » Fri Mar 18, 2011 11:35 pm

jo533281 wrote:
Thunktank wrote:
It looks like the Orthodox on CPS have aquired a younger version of Del. :yes: :joy:
Still haven't figured out what that means. All in due time, I suppose.

But if you're happy with it, Thunktank, then I guess it can't be all that bad. Just make sure you Orthodox folks keep me in check. Sometimes, I need someone to come along and knock some sense into me. Better it be a fellow OC (or even Del :D ).
Del's a great guy and friend. He loves us Orthodox too. To me he's like the big brother that's fun to pick on sometimes, It's a guilty pleasure of mine. Sometimes we disagree but when all is said and done, we're a kindred spirit about most things so when a thread gets Delled he gets the brotherly nudge. What else can I say.

And Jo5, I've PM'd a few other Orthodox brethern including Baines letting them know that they should keep an eye on me too. I'll ask the same of you. We may not always see eye to eye about everything and that's ok, but out n out heresy isn't anything any of us want to be guilty of, so if you think I'm guilty of it, you better say something, even publically to correct it or ask for my clarification.

User avatar
jo533281
like R2D2, just not as cool
like R2D2, just not as cool
Posts: 3115
Joined: Sat Feb 05, 2011 6:00 pm
Location: Grand Rapids, MI

Post by jo533281 » Fri Mar 18, 2011 11:45 pm

Thunktank wrote:

And Jo5, I've PM'd a few other Orthodox brethern including Baines letting them know that they should keep an eye on me too. I'll ask the same of you. We may not always see eye to eye about everything and that's ok, but out n out heresy isn't anything any of us want to be guilty of, so if you think I'm guilty of it, you better say something, even publically to correct it or ask for my clarification.
No problem. And now, it's time for a smoke, I think. Goodnight.
"This is not facebook, we are not here to boost your self esteem or hang on your every word." -Zed-

"It's all right, Andy! It's just bolognaise!"

Most Likely to Draw Pirates with a Post

User avatar
Thoth
Never had a corndog taco shake
Never had a corndog taco shake
Posts: 12268
Joined: Thu Dec 27, 2007 6:00 pm
Location: Formerly Jersey City, World's Greatest City.

Post by Thoth » Sat Mar 19, 2011 2:23 am

CaptainBlack wrote:I grew up with a Catholic father and Protestant mother. Anyone following my posts would not be surprised to learn that I was raised Protestant. Because of long conversations with my dad, I’ve often defended Catholicism among my Protestant brethren.


I have attempted to show love and respect for those of the Catholic faith … almost to the point of walking on egg shells. I value civil discourse and the fellowship here. What follows may seem to indicate otherwise but the intent is there.


It would have been great if this thread could somehow have brought us closer. It has instead highlighted what divides us.


To my Catholic friends, you believe that your religion is truth and defend it vigorously as such. God bless you for that. Declaring your church as the only true church, or only venue for living in the Gospel will not advance the dialog beyond getting a few “+1’s” from those who already agree with you.


You declare that a relationship with Mary enhances one’s relationship with Jesus. Yet throughout CPS and many discussions I’ve had with other Catholics, the focus is on and the passion is for Mary, not Christ himself unless one is at Mass. Much less is heard about a relationship with Jesus on a personal level day by day. Access appears to be through Mary or the Saints. I could be wrong here but that is the message that is coming out.


After all of this discussion, it is inexplicable to me how Marion theology morphed from the fact that God chose a young woman of remarkable faith and humility.


The whole “this is my body” statement comes down to whether or not Christ was speaking metaphorically. For many, including myself there is a strong case to be made that Jesus was doing just that. But hey, that could be the topic of another 40 page thread.

Going from a literal reading of that passage to the manner in which God is worshipped still seems to be quite a leap.


You may find it interesting to know that a number of Catholics have sought Protestant churches in an effort to learn how to live the Gospel and live in Christ.

My Catholic father, in addition to attending Mass, worships with my mother at a Protestant church … finding it to be much more spiritually alive and vibrant than his experiences at his church. I’ve been to his parish and know what he’s talking about. Granted, all Catholic churches are not the same, your mileage may vary.


The Catholic church in practice bears little resemblance to the church described in the Bible. I imagine some Catholics would agree with me as their belief and practices are derived not solely from Scripture but also from men who church leaders have declared have been conferred the gift of infallibility in such matters.


It is for these reasons among others that I have big time problems with Catholicism. You may feel that Protestants are somehow “missing out.” The same is felt for you guys.


Before this thread started I was convinced that despite thread started we were united by a common bond in Christ. Yet while that may be true, I leave this thread troubled by all that divides us and a conviction that we have different faiths practiced in the context of vastly different religions. I’ll be praying for you. And I know some of you will be praying for me.
Thank you for deep thoughtful post, Like you I pray that one day we may all be one as He is one.

Though all I could say in terms of Orthodox veneration of St. Mary, to paraphrase Fr. Alexander Schmemann, if all that scripture mentioned of the blessed Virgin is that Christ was "born of a virgin named Mary"and nothing more was known about her, it still would be sufficent for the honor and veneration given to her. If you can get a hold of a copy of Celebration of the Faith vol.3: The Virgin Maryby him. It clearly explains the the why and how. Just give you a deeper more correct understanding of our view. If you were still in Jersey, would have loaned you my copy.
"Go and reconcile with him who has trespassed against you before he comes and apologises to you and steals your crown" - H.H. Pope Cyril VI<br><br>"O Lord I was not aware of the treasure within me that is You" - H.H. Pope Shenouda III

User avatar
jruegg
Mr. Eggs
Mr. Eggs
Posts: 25543
Joined: Thu Dec 17, 2009 6:00 pm
Location: Kingdom of God (Mk 1:15)
Contact:

Post by jruegg » Sat Mar 19, 2011 5:02 am

Anyone care about my opinion? :lol:

User avatar
Del
Hacked by Kellyanne Conway
Hacked by Kellyanne Conway
Posts: 36900
Joined: Mon Mar 03, 2008 6:00 pm
Location: Madison, WI
Contact:

Post by Del » Sat Mar 19, 2011 8:26 am

Thanks for all the comments, guys. I have taken them to heart.

But I'm not the focus, here. I shared a lesson that was valuable to me. Beyond the faith in Sacred Tradition v. the doctrine of sola scriptura, we also have those different relationships with Sacred Scripture.

I hoped that some people would find the analogy of living in Scripture and standing on Scripture to be useful. Even disagreeing with the analogy would be instructive. It's just an analogy -- I can see the weak points in it.

Talking about me is just boring. :yawn:
CaptainBlack wrote: You declare that a relationship with Mary enhances one’s relationship with Jesus. Yet throughout CPS and many discussions I’ve had with other Catholics, the focus is on and the passion is for Mary, not Christ himself unless one is at Mass. Much less is heard about a relationship with Jesus on a personal level day by day. Access appears to be through Mary or the Saints. I could be wrong here but that is the message that is coming out.
To be fair, the Protestant brothers don't talk much their relationships with Jesus, either. It's not an easy thing to share.

All I can do, Cap'n, is open a bit of my personal prayer life.... which is always a dangerous thing to do. Prayer is very personal, and sharing it feels like boasting. Who am I to claim that I actually share some conversation with my Lord, y'know?

In general, Jesus gives Himself to me in the Eucharist. Words fail to describe how intimate this is. the God who humbled Himself to become man has humbled Himself again, and becomes food for my soul.

I do a lot of "visualization" in my prayer. That's not a common style, so please don't think I'm wierd if you don't do this.

In my prayer life, Jesus is my King. I like to imagine myself to be in the presence of the person to whom I am praying.... and Jesus is always seated on His Throne. It is the Lord of the Universe Who gives Himself to me in the Eucharist. I can barely dare to approach that throne -- Jesus can give Himself to me as often as He wants, but that doesn't mean I can just saunter jauntily into His presence and say "Hey, what's up Buddy!"

I almost always open my mental prayer with a conversation with Mary. I am mindful that she is Queen of Heaven, but she is also my spiritual Mother. I share whatever is on my heart. (I know that God hears all of this; He is not cheated.)

When I have examined my conscience with Mary (and occasionally, received some motherly advice), she escorts me into the Throne room. My face hits the floor and I beg forgiveness for my sins. He does not speak to me in this prayer. He listens, often sternly. Sometimes, He reveals His will upon my heart. (Often -- "I will forgive you. Come back after you've confessed to My priest.")

Anyhow.... Mary is my broker. She coaches and encourages my prayer life, and she is my escort into the presence of Jesus -- where I would not dare to go alone. My relationship with Mary allows me to have an intimate interior conversation, and esteem Jesus as my King.

Without Mary's help, I'd have to approach Jesus as a distant Lord, or presume that Jesus is my buddy-friend.
"Utter frogshit from start to finish." - Onyx

"I shall not wear a crown of gold where my Master wore a crown of thorns." - Godfrey de Bouillon

User avatar
wosbald
Crux' Cleveland Correspondent
Crux' Cleveland Correspondent
Posts: 18865
Joined: Mon Feb 25, 2008 6:00 pm
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
Contact:

Post by wosbald » Sat Mar 19, 2011 8:36 am

+JMJ+
Del wrote:Talking about me is just boring. :yawn:
To say nothing of "talking with".




"In the end, My Immaculate Heart will triumph." - Our Lady of Fatima

User avatar
DepartedLight
That boy's got a Thorazine deficiency.
Posts: 26834
Joined: Thu Nov 19, 2009 6:00 pm
Location: Tobacco Fairy HQ, North Carolina

Post by DepartedLight » Sat Mar 19, 2011 9:41 am

Classic Del-ism:
Del wrote:I'm not the focus, here. I shared a lesson that was valuable to me.
:?: :?: :?: :?: :?: :?: :?: :?: :?: :?: :?:

:lol:

User avatar
DepartedLight
That boy's got a Thorazine deficiency.
Posts: 26834
Joined: Thu Nov 19, 2009 6:00 pm
Location: Tobacco Fairy HQ, North Carolina

Post by DepartedLight » Sat Mar 19, 2011 9:42 am

wosbald wrote:+JMJ+
DepartedLight wrote:I would like to note that the Catholic Church in communion with the Roman See does not command the faithful to have a Marian devotion in order to be in communion with the Church. She does require that certain aspects of Mary are believed by the congregant. But, unless given as Penance, at no time is a Catholic obligated to recite the Hail Mary, or have any devotion to the Blessed Mother whatsoever. It is highly encouraged, but the burden is not placed upon the shoulders of Catholics that, for whatever reasons, are not comfortable with particular Marian devotions.
This really is only true in a limited and individual sense. Yes, it is true that no one is strictly required to practice any particular private devotion to the Virgin. But simply being in communion with the Church automatically unifies all Catholics in devotion to Her. IOW, the Church, Herself, venerates the Virgin on behalf of all of the Faithful. The public worship of the Church (be it in the Liturgy, the Divine Office, the feast days of the Church Year) repeatedly references and petitions the Virgin. For example, although one may not have developed a deep private devotion to St. Dominic Savio, the fact that he is venerated by the universal Church tacitly confers on him a certain implicit devotion to the young saint.

So, although one would not be obliged to practice any particular Marian devotion (just as one would not be required to practice a specific, private devotion to Jesus in the Blessed Sacrament), a person who has issues, in principle, against devotion to the Virgin would certainly find himself in conflict with the Church.
I think this is very fair.

User avatar
j1n
Brother of the Briar
Brother of the Briar
Posts: 1399
Joined: Sun Jul 27, 2008 6:00 pm
Location: southeast of the northwest territories
Contact:

Re: Yeah, we worship Mary. You gotta problem with 'dat?!?

Post by j1n » Mon May 07, 2018 7:47 pm

Another old thread revival...
I'm gonna read through this whole thread hopefully at work tomorrow. I hope I can find some resolution in it. In the meantime, I'm hoping maybe some of you Roman Catholic folks (especially those who have converted from Protestantism) might weigh in.
I suppose because of my evangelical, anti-Catholic upbringing, I am having a real issue reconciling, in my own heart and mind, views on Mary. I do NOT want to pray to, or worship, anyone other than Jesus...God. I don't even want to come close. But I want to understand the Catholic view of Mary. In plain English. For the layman. This is going to be something that will come up, formally, as I seek to enter communion with the Catholic Church.
I'm your huckleberry

Ruin my dinner and I'll ruin your life.
- my wife

User avatar
DepartedLight
That boy's got a Thorazine deficiency.
Posts: 26834
Joined: Thu Nov 19, 2009 6:00 pm
Location: Tobacco Fairy HQ, North Carolina

Re: Yeah, we worship Mary. You gotta problem with 'dat?!?

Post by DepartedLight » Mon May 07, 2018 8:08 pm

Why? Good Lord, why?

User avatar
wosbald
Crux' Cleveland Correspondent
Crux' Cleveland Correspondent
Posts: 18865
Joined: Mon Feb 25, 2008 6:00 pm
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
Contact:

Re: Yeah, we worship Mary. You gotta problem with 'dat?!?

Post by wosbald » Mon May 07, 2018 8:30 pm

+JMJ+
j1n wrote:
Mon May 07, 2018 7:47 pm
… I suppose because of my evangelical, anti-Catholic upbringing, I am having a real issue reconciling, in my own heart and mind, views on Mary. I do NOT want to pray to, or worship, anyone other than Jesus...God. I don't even want to come close. …
If you don't even want to "come close", yer likely setting yerself up for some for heartburn and insomnia. In the Incarnation, God "came close" to Man, and came closest to one Human Person in particular: The Virgin. Salvation History is a story of "coming close" to realities which are ever-more astonishingly unexpected. If you want your god to be neat and tame and comparmentalizable, stay Protestant.

Having fears, tremors and nightsweats will be normal, healthy and likely unavoidable. But having preconditions ported over from Protestantism won't serve you well.




"In the end, My Immaculate Heart will triumph." - Our Lady of Fatima

User avatar
Thunktank
Terminal Lance. Perpetual Sea Lawyer. Unicorn Aficionado
Terminal Lance.  Perpetual Sea Lawyer. Unicorn Aficionado
Posts: 21449
Joined: Sat Oct 25, 2008 6:00 pm
Location: North Texas

Re: Yeah, we worship Mary. You gotta problem with 'dat?!?

Post by Thunktank » Mon May 07, 2018 8:51 pm

j1n wrote:
Mon May 07, 2018 7:47 pm
Another old thread revival...
I'm gonna read through this whole thread hopefully at work tomorrow. I hope I can find some resolution in it. In the meantime, I'm hoping maybe some of you Roman Catholic folks (especially those who have converted from Protestantism) might weigh in.
I suppose because of my evangelical, anti-Catholic upbringing, I am having a real issue reconciling, in my own heart and mind, views on Mary. I do NOT want to pray to, or worship, anyone other than Jesus...God. I don't even want to come close. But I want to understand the Catholic view of Mary. In plain English. For the layman. This is going to be something that will come up, formally, as I seek to enter communion with the Catholic Church.
I was an Evangelical who converted to Mary veneration. If you’re still worried about taking something from God due to him by venerating the Saints, my own advice is don’t do it yet then. When you come to believe that venerating the Saints actually increases praise to God, then you will be able to venerate without fear, instead you might feel a bit shy instead. That is a good place to be.

User avatar
Thunktank
Terminal Lance. Perpetual Sea Lawyer. Unicorn Aficionado
Terminal Lance.  Perpetual Sea Lawyer. Unicorn Aficionado
Posts: 21449
Joined: Sat Oct 25, 2008 6:00 pm
Location: North Texas

Re: Yeah, we worship Mary. You gotta problem with 'dat?!?

Post by Thunktank » Mon May 07, 2018 8:58 pm

wosbald wrote:
Mon May 07, 2018 8:30 pm
+JMJ+
j1n wrote:
Mon May 07, 2018 7:47 pm
… I suppose because of my evangelical, anti-Catholic upbringing, I am having a real issue reconciling, in my own heart and mind, views on Mary. I do NOT want to pray to, or worship, anyone other than Jesus...God. I don't even want to come close. …
If you don't even want to "come close", yer likely setting yerself up for some for heartburn and insomnia. In the Incarnation, God "came close" to Man, and came closest to one Human Person in particular: The Virgin. Salvation History is a story of "coming close" to realities which are ever-more astonishingly unexpected. If you want your god to be neat and tame and comparmentalizable, stay Protestant.

Having fears, tremors and nightsweats will be normal, healthy and likely unavoidable. But having preconditions ported over from Protestantism won't serve you well.
Having fears, tremors and night sweats is not healthy and I don’t think Mary wants to terrorize a Christian no matter what sort of preconditions they wrestle with. When the time comes that a Protestant understands and accepts the incarnation as a Mary loving Catholic might, then The excitement will be more positive than negative, the “fear” and “tremors” will not seem dirty then.
Last edited by Thunktank on Mon May 07, 2018 9:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
wosbald
Crux' Cleveland Correspondent
Crux' Cleveland Correspondent
Posts: 18865
Joined: Mon Feb 25, 2008 6:00 pm
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
Contact:

Re: Yeah, we worship Mary. You gotta problem with 'dat?!?

Post by wosbald » Mon May 07, 2018 9:03 pm

+JMJ+
Thunktank wrote:
Mon May 07, 2018 8:51 pm
… If you’re still worried about taking something from God due to him by venerating the Saints, my own advice is don’t do it yet then. …
Tru dat.

In fact, if the pastor/spiritual director is doing his job, he won't approve the conversion until the "opportune time". Today may very well be the day of salvation, but it ain't the day of hair-on-fire, going-for-broke recklessness.




"In the end, My Immaculate Heart will triumph." - Our Lady of Fatima

User avatar
Thunktank
Terminal Lance. Perpetual Sea Lawyer. Unicorn Aficionado
Terminal Lance.  Perpetual Sea Lawyer. Unicorn Aficionado
Posts: 21449
Joined: Sat Oct 25, 2008 6:00 pm
Location: North Texas

Re: Yeah, we worship Mary. You gotta problem with 'dat?!?

Post by Thunktank » Mon May 07, 2018 9:06 pm

wosbald wrote:
Mon May 07, 2018 9:03 pm
+JMJ+
Thunktank wrote:
Mon May 07, 2018 8:51 pm
… If you’re still worried about taking something from God due to him by venerating the Saints, my own advice is don’t do it yet then. …
Tru dat.

In fact, if the pastor/spiritual director is doing his job, he won't approve the conversion until the "opportune time". Today may very well be the day of salvation, but it ain't the day of hair-on-fire, going-for-broke recklessness.
Oh so we basically agree then? I thought maybe you gave your mother a sword to lopp off his head if he didn’t hurry up and bow down. :lol:

Ok, that’s all from me here. I really don’t want to banter over this stuff. I do know the struggle with this is all I’m saying. When I finally venerated Mary it was in the Divine Liturgy. It really brought everything into perspective for me.
Last edited by Thunktank on Mon May 07, 2018 9:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
ReverendThom
A Mari Usque Ad Mare
A Mari Usque Ad Mare
Posts: 3373
Joined: Wed Jul 29, 2015 9:08 am
Location: Winnipeg, MB
Contact:

Re: Yeah, we worship Mary. You gotta problem with 'dat?!?

Post by ReverendThom » Mon May 07, 2018 9:09 pm

Maybe this will help with understanding https://books.google.ca/books/about/Mar ... edir_esc=y

Sent from my SM-G935W8 using Tapatalk

"Pipe smokers used to be among the smartest people walking around. It's not true anymore." - Rusty

TNLawPiper
BrotherOfTheBriar YouHeartlessBastards
BrotherOfTheBriar YouHeartlessBastards
Posts: 17164
Joined: Sun Sep 14, 2008 6:00 pm

Re: Yeah, we worship Mary. You gotta problem with 'dat?!?

Post by TNLawPiper » Mon May 07, 2018 10:04 pm

Perhaps I approached my conversion from a poor starting point, but I think if you're willing to recognize the Church's authority and the course of revelation throughout time, one can confess the Catholic faith even while struggling to fully commit to every single tenet of the Catholic faith (not that the neophyte convert could even know them all well enough to have an opinion on them, much less a devotion).

My experiences from the first 22 years of my life still create a certain questioning when certain practice or beliefs are discussed. There's a reflexive cringe at times. Nevertheless, I repeat the words and the gestures in hopes that someday I might appreciate them fully.

User avatar
Del
Hacked by Kellyanne Conway
Hacked by Kellyanne Conway
Posts: 36900
Joined: Mon Mar 03, 2008 6:00 pm
Location: Madison, WI
Contact:

Re: Yeah, we worship Mary. You gotta problem with 'dat?!?

Post by Del » Tue May 08, 2018 6:03 am

j1n wrote:
Mon May 07, 2018 7:47 pm
I suppose because of my evangelical, anti-Catholic upbringing, I am having a real issue reconciling, in my own heart and mind, views on Mary. I do NOT want to pray to, or worship, anyone other than Jesus...God.
This is an almost rudely short answer to a very long journey, but here goes:

Praying is not worship.

Worship = That which is due to God alone.

Praying = talking with someone. We talk to people, on earth and in heaven, all the time. Praying is not uniquely given to God.

When a Christian receives the living Christ in the Eucharist, that is a unique relationship -- no one else gives us His Flesh and Blood for our salvation. That is worship. Once you have that unique relationship, you "talk" with anyone you want to.

However, there are some things that we say in our prayers that we only say to God. Things like:
- Thank You saving us from our sins.
- Thank You for giving us Your Flesh and Blood, so that we can have life in You.
- You alone are my Lord -- everything that I am belongs to You.


We don't say those things when we talk to our friends, family, Mary, or that saints. That would be blasphemous.

But we often ask our friends, family, Mary, and the saints with prayers of "help me." And "pray for me." And "I'd like for us to work on this together, please."
======================================================

It will take time to get this into your bones.

Be patient with yourself, and let the Holy Spirit guide you.

No one will make you talk to Mary or an angel or a saint. You will know when you are ready to embrace these relationships.
==========================================

PS - Everything that you already have from your Evangelical tradition is good. Very good.

You won't have to give up your unique relationship with Christ, or your devotion to Scripture, or praying in Tongues (if you have that gift), or any other gift.

Encountering Apostolic faith is like entering a huge banquet full of delicious and exotic foods -- but all of your old favorites are still there too.
"Utter frogshit from start to finish." - Onyx

"I shall not wear a crown of gold where my Master wore a crown of thorns." - Godfrey de Bouillon

User avatar
tuttle
Theology Room Mod
Theology Room Mod
Posts: 12643
Joined: Tue Dec 02, 2008 6:00 pm
Location: Middle-west
Contact:

Re: Yeah, we worship Mary. You gotta problem with 'dat?!?

Post by tuttle » Tue May 08, 2018 7:37 am

I just skimmed this blast from the past and it just made me miss Bigwill's patience and clarity on things.

And Dewey. I miss Dewey.
"Better to die cheerfully with the aid of a little tobacco, than to live disagreeably and remorseful without." -CS Lewis

Post Reply