Tithing

For those deep thinkers out there.
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Fainn
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Tithing

Post by Fainn » Sat Feb 08, 2020 6:35 pm

Seems like every supporter of tithing tries to promote the belief that God will bless you. Yet, most of the passages they quote were addressed to certain people at certain times. For example, Malachi 3:10 was addressed to the people in charge of rebuilding the temple after the Babylonian captivity. There is neither Temple nor storehouse today. Or what about Proverbs 3:9-10? It's asy for King Solomon to tell his princely son who is already wealthy that God will bless him I am unable to find any passage supporting God's blessings by tithing in the New Testament. It seems like your blessings and relationship with God is based on works. I am unable to find any passage supporting God's blessings brought about by tithing in the New Testament,
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Re: Tithing

Post by AnungUnRama » Sat Feb 08, 2020 6:48 pm

Much of the way the modern church is structured and operates can be found nowhere in scripture.

The tithe is how the temple ran. IIR there was a second tithe too that was squirreled away and used to finance one of the great 7 year feasts but my memory is so fuzzy on that it's not even funny.

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Re: Tithing

Post by ryland » Sat Feb 08, 2020 7:09 pm

By the time the Israelites gave all they were supposed to, it ended up being closer to 30%, not 10% of their income. The kingdom that Jesus ushered in welcomes a spirit of generosity. The last figure I read but can't find is that if someone makes $32,500 or more a year they are in the top 1% of the income earners in the world. It's interesting to read through Luke's account how many times Jesus ran up against greed and wealth related issues. Then we get to Zaccheus and we get a different picture from someone who repented.
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Re: Tithing

Post by Jocose » Sat Feb 08, 2020 9:29 pm

Not being nasty. Why would you want to give to get?
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Re: Tithing

Post by Fainn » Sat Feb 08, 2020 9:31 pm

Jocose wrote:
Sat Feb 08, 2020 9:29 pm
Not being nasty. Why would you want to give to get?
That's kind of my point. Shouldn't it be done because its the right thing to do or out of thankfulness?
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Re: Tithing

Post by Jocose » Sat Feb 08, 2020 9:33 pm

Fainn wrote:
Sat Feb 08, 2020 9:31 pm
Jocose wrote:
Sat Feb 08, 2020 9:29 pm
Not being nasty. Why would you want to give to get?
That's kind of my point. Shouldn't it be done because its the right thing to do or out of thankfulness?
Does anyone think differently? Besides televangelists?
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Re: Tithing

Post by Fainn » Sat Feb 08, 2020 9:36 pm

Jocose wrote:
Sat Feb 08, 2020 9:33 pm
Fainn wrote:
Sat Feb 08, 2020 9:31 pm
Jocose wrote:
Sat Feb 08, 2020 9:29 pm
Not being nasty. Why would you want to give to get?
That's kind of my point. Shouldn't it be done because its the right thing to do or out of thankfulness?
Does anyone think differently? Besides televangelists?
Pretty much every pastor I have seen in person.
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Re: Tithing

Post by Jocose » Sat Feb 08, 2020 9:38 pm

Fainn wrote:
Sat Feb 08, 2020 9:36 pm
Jocose wrote:
Sat Feb 08, 2020 9:33 pm
Fainn wrote:
Sat Feb 08, 2020 9:31 pm
Jocose wrote:
Sat Feb 08, 2020 9:29 pm
Not being nasty. Why would you want to give to get?
That's kind of my point. Shouldn't it be done because its the right thing to do or out of thankfulness?
Does anyone think differently? Besides televangelists?
Pretty much every pastor I have seen in person.
This matter is beyond my scope.
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Re: Tithing

Post by DepartedLight » Sat Feb 08, 2020 9:49 pm

“But woe to you Pharisees! for you tithe mint and rue and every herb, and neglect justice and the love of God; these you ought to have done, without neglecting the others." - Jesus

The Gospel According to Saint Luke 11:42
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Re: Tithing

Post by AnungUnRama » Sat Feb 08, 2020 9:53 pm


ryland wrote:By the time the Israelites gave all they were supposed to, it ended up being closer to 30%, not 10% of their income.
Exactly. Additionally, it was supposed to wind up being essentially biblical wealth redistribution for lack of a better term. It never worked bc it was never really followed. It is also, again, not how modern (read "western") churches wre structured.


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Re: Tithing

Post by DepartedLight » Sat Feb 08, 2020 10:25 pm

I think that a Christian's heart is one of giving.

The toe the line of 10% is a non stater.

1 week is 168 hrs

56 hrs for an average of 8hrs of sleep per day.

112 remains.

10% of 112 hrs/week is 11.2/week.

If one is concerned with tithing, spend 11hrs in one week talking to Jesus about it.

That a little more than an hour and a half a day.

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Re: Tithing

Post by michigander » Sun Feb 09, 2020 6:47 am

TLDR
Don't give to get. Give to honor God with your finances and to overcome the love of money.


Disclaimer: if this sounds pious or self righteous in any way please forgive me. I am only sharing my experience. I do not consider myself a righteous person (not by a long shot).

I started tithing when I was a teenager because I was taught that I should (I was not forced). It was not because I wanted to be "blessed".

When I started making "real" money I continued the practice. When I got married my wife had to come to terms with it, but by that time I felt like that was "God's money" and not tithing was like stealing from God. (Yes, I know, it's all God's.)

We struggled to tithe at times but always continued tithing. There were numerous times that we would have been short on cash, but some unexpected money would come.

If you're considering tithing i would suggest starting with something small with the goal of increasing your giving over time.

Now we are debt free. I hold no claim to the future. Tomorrow we could run into some financial tragedy. However, if this happens we would continue to tithe.

I am not saying that if you tithe you will be blessed financially. I believe it will increase your faith that He will meet your needs. You will become a more generous person and free from greed or the love of money.

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Re: Tithing

Post by TNLawPiper » Sun Feb 09, 2020 9:22 am

Fainn wrote:
Sat Feb 08, 2020 6:35 pm
Seems like every supporter of tithing tries to promote the belief that God will bless you. Yet, most of the passages they quote were addressed to certain people at certain times. For example, Malachi 3:10 was addressed to the people in charge of rebuilding the temple after the Babylonian captivity. There is neither Temple nor storehouse today. Or what about Proverbs 3:9-10? It's asy for King Solomon to tell his princely son who is already wealthy that God will bless him I am unable to find any passage supporting God's blessings by tithing in the New Testament. It seems like your blessings and relationship with God is based on works. I am unable to find any passage supporting God's blessings brought about by tithing in the New Testament,
There are two reasons why preachers claim that tithing will bring blessings: 1) they don’t believe that preaching tithing as a commandment would be as effective; or 2) they’re prosperity gospel types who need their congregations to give much more than 10%.

The first is not necessarily incorrect. I’ve been in churches where the congregation isn’t giving. Putting their self-interests on the line is not necessarily wrong, but it may be disingenuous and have less Biblical support.

The second? Well, I feel badly for those who preach falsely in order to take advantage of their congregants. They may do well on Earth, but they’re likely to fare poorly in eternity.
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Re: Tithing

Post by CodeMonkey » Sun Feb 09, 2020 12:47 pm

I pay tithes because I want to. I believe that God does bless me for doing so. I don't get large amounts of unexpected case, but I believe that my income stretches further. A couple of examples in recent times.

I had switched to email for my credit card statement. One day it came to my mind that that was coming due. I signed on and discovered it was due that day. I was able to make the payment and avoid a late charge. Last summer my garage door opener quit. I went to pick one up. A store employee helped my locate the opener. I picked one out because it was tagged as being on sale. She told me the sale had ended the previous day, but because they failed to pull the sign she had to honor the sale price. Neither of these items would have put me in financial strain, but I chalk them up to God making my money stretch further.

I hear people say they can't afford to pay tithes. My mother lived on a fixed income of about 900.00 a month. The first thing she did when her check came in was take out ten percent to give to God. She also supported a missionary and gave offerings above her tithes. She did it because she wanted to, even though a minister told her she didn't need to pay tithes. He said she had already tithed on that money. She was always able to pay her bills, which included a house payment.
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Re: Tithing

Post by Thunktank » Sun Feb 09, 2020 1:18 pm

michigander wrote:
Sun Feb 09, 2020 6:47 am
TLDR
Don't give to get. Give to honor God with your finances and to overcome the love of money.


Disclaimer: if this sounds pious or self righteous in any way please forgive me. I am only sharing my experience. I do not consider myself a righteous person (not by a long shot).

I started tithing when I was a teenager because I was taught that I should (I was not forced). It was not because I wanted to be "blessed".

When I started making "real" money I continued the practice. When I got married my wife had to come to terms with it, but by that time I felt like that was "God's money" and not tithing was like stealing from God. (Yes, I know, it's all God's.)

We struggled to tithe at times but always continued tithing. There were numerous times that we would have been short on cash, but some unexpected money would come.

If you're considering tithing i would suggest starting with something small with the goal of increasing your giving over time.

Now we are debt free. I hold no claim to the future. Tomorrow we could run into some financial tragedy. However, if this happens we would continue to tithe.

I am not saying that if you tithe you will be blessed financially. I believe it will increase your faith that He will meet your needs. You will become a more generous person and free from greed or the love of money.
Good stuff right there.
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Re: Tithing

Post by Fainn » Sun Feb 09, 2020 3:25 pm

CodeMonkey wrote:
Sun Feb 09, 2020 12:47 pm
I pay tithes because I want to. I believe that God does bless me for doing so. I don't get large amounts of unexpected case, but I believe that my income stretches further. A couple of examples in recent times.

I had switched to email for my credit card statement. One day it came to my mind that that was coming due. I signed on and discovered it was due that day. I was able to make the payment and avoid a late charge. Last summer my garage door opener quit. I went to pick one up. A store employee helped my locate the opener. I picked one out because it was tagged as being on sale. She told me the sale had ended the previous day, but because they failed to pull the sign she had to honor the sale price. Neither of these items would have put me in financial strain, but I chalk them up to God making my money stretch further.

I hear people say they can't afford to pay tithes. My mother lived on a fixed income of about 900.00 a month. The first thing she did when her check came in was take out ten percent to give to God. She also supported a missionary and gave offerings above her tithes. She did it because she wanted to, even though a minister told her she didn't need to pay tithes. He said she had already tithed on that money. She was always able to pay her bills, which included a house payment.
Glad it worked for her. I have found that it doesn't matter whether I tithe or not. I have experienced lean times while tithing and abundant times without tithing. I don't think human action can influence God's plans.
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Re: Tithing

Post by Fainn » Sun Feb 09, 2020 6:20 pm

I think God desires a genuine relationship above all.
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Re: Tithing

Post by DepartedLight » Sun Feb 09, 2020 10:37 pm

Fainn wrote:
Sun Feb 09, 2020 6:20 pm
I think God desires a genuine relationship above all.
:D
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Re: Tithing

Post by FredS » Mon Feb 10, 2020 10:00 am

Fainn wrote:
Sat Feb 08, 2020 6:35 pm
. . . There is neither Temple nor storehouse today. . .
Au contraire Pierre. The modern church has expenses just as the ancient one did. Even when paid off, our buildings need new roofs, toilets, coffee makers, toilet paper, and electricity. Where do you suppose the money for that stuff comes from? And storehouses are still very much in demand. I wouldn't care to be involved in a church that can't or won't help the poor. Whether that's a winter coat drive, or backpacks full of school supplies, or sandwiches for the guys who live under the bridge, we're still storing up goods for those who go through lean times.
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Re: Tithing

Post by michigander » Mon Feb 10, 2020 11:59 am

FredS wrote:
Mon Feb 10, 2020 10:00 am
Fainn wrote:
Sat Feb 08, 2020 6:35 pm
. . . There is neither Temple nor storehouse today. . .
Au contraire Pierre. The modern church has expenses just as the ancient one did. Even when paid off, our buildings need new roofs, toilets, coffee makers, toilet paper, and electricity. Where do you suppose the money for that stuff comes from? And storehouses are still very much in demand. I wouldn't care to be involved in a church that can't or won't help the poor. Whether that's a winter coat drive, or backpacks full of school supplies, or sandwiches for the guys who live under the bridge, we're still storing up goods for those who go through lean times.
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