Old Scofield vs Edition III

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durangopipe
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Re: Old Scofield vs Edition III

Post by durangopipe » Sat Feb 06, 2021 12:31 pm

Del wrote:
Sat Feb 06, 2021 7:18 am
durangopipe wrote:
Fri Feb 05, 2021 9:08 pm
Del wrote:
Fri Feb 05, 2021 8:44 pm
durangopipe wrote:
Fri Feb 05, 2021 1:51 pm
KJV Bible, Lux Leather, Black (No Scofield Notes)

Image

Del will be quick to point out that it's missing a few chapters. :D
Actually, I've never heard of this Schofield guy. I was going to let the knowledgeable folk answer Fain's question.

I appreciate this general advice regarding Bible versions: The version that you will actually read and use is the best one.
=========================================

The original KJV had all 73 of the Sacred Books.

As I understand it, the missing Books weren't taken out of English-language versions of The Bible until early in the 1800's.... and that was a style decision made by printing companies at the time, rather than being any sort of dogmatic declaration by a ministerial authority.
In the original King James Version of the Bible, the apocrypha were included but separated from the other books of the Bible and placed in a separate section to indicate lesser authority.

Thorny theological stuff, Dell.

The KJV Scofield Reference bible was a very commonly used edition of the Bible that included copious linked references and commentary influenced by dispensationalist theology.

I didn’t know what Luther’s Bible included, so I looked it up and found this:

Luther’s Bible included them with a note that said, “Apocrypha: These books are not held equal to the Sacred Scriptures, and yet are useful and good for reading.”
Luther was a "dogmatic declaration by a ministerial authority" unto himself.

Simply.... He was his own pope. Which was fine, as far as that goes. But I have no idea why anyone else should listen to him, when everyone else can go and be his own pope.
That reduces something very weighty and difficult to something inappropriately simple, Del - which this matter of canon most definitely is not.

The books that constitute canon are not consistent throughout Christendom. It’s not just a matter of the difference between Luther’s canon and the current Catholic canon. And it wasn’t just Luther who is responsible for the issue.

The Orthodox Churches’ canons are different from the Protestant and Roman canons. The proper place, use and significance of the several canons and parts of canon divide the Christian world.

Canon was one of the grave matters faced by the early church. The way canon has been presented within traditions has changed in the modern world (the King James bible’s handling of the Apocrypha is an example). It remains a grave and complex matter.

After the mystery of the trinity, few other difficult matters have divided the church as deeply.

This isn’t all about Luther. I don’t believe it’s even mostly about Luther.

Of course, if you believe that every professing Christian (or biblical scholar, or theologian) who does not affirm your own faith tradition’s current understanding of canon is wrong, this difficult matter becomes far less difficult.

But I don’t think you’re the kind of person who would want to say that. Your heart is too big.
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Re: Old Scofield vs Edition III

Post by Adam Z » Sat Feb 06, 2021 12:50 pm

Fainn wrote:
jruegg wrote:
Fri Feb 05, 2021 3:03 pm
Fainn wrote:
Fri Feb 05, 2021 2:27 pm
I want some notes. But is there anything else in that price range or cheaper?
What kind of notes are you looking for? Lots of 'Study' Bibles with notes focus on different things.

For example (from some of the Bibles on my shelves):

Textual notes
Archaeological notes
Life-Application notes
Theological notes
Apologetics notes
Early Church Fathers notes

I have yet to find a Bible that contains in-depth notes on all of these topics simultaneously.
I think I would prefer a reseasonably priced reformed one. Under $40.
Fainn - I think I have just the thing you’re looking for: https://www.heritagebooks.org/kjvstudybible/hardcover


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Re: Old Scofield vs Edition III

Post by jruegg » Sat Feb 06, 2021 5:20 pm

Fainn wrote:
Fri Feb 05, 2021 9:15 pm
jruegg wrote:
Fri Feb 05, 2021 3:03 pm
Fainn wrote:
Fri Feb 05, 2021 2:27 pm
I want some notes. But is there anything else in that price range or cheaper?
What kind of notes are you looking for? Lots of 'Study' Bibles with notes focus on different things.

For example (from some of the Bibles on my shelves):

Textual notes
Archaeological notes
Life-Application notes
Theological notes
Apologetics notes
Early Church Fathers notes

I have yet to find a Bible that contains in-depth notes on all of these topics simultaneously.
I think I would prefer a reseasonably priced reformed one. Under $40.
https://www.christianbook.com/esv-study ... es|1001595
https://www.christianbook.com/nrsv-cult ... event=EBRN
https://www.christianbook.com/ceb-commo ... event=EBRN
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Re: Old Scofield vs Edition III

Post by Fainn » Sat Feb 06, 2021 5:25 pm

coco wrote:
Fri Feb 05, 2021 11:43 am
Early 1600's English culture, and the language that went with it, has been gone from this earth for some time. I recommend something more up-to-date.
That's exactly the attitude that gave us Hillsong and Bethel.
Opinions are like butts. Everyone has one, but mine is the best.

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Re: Old Scofield vs Edition III

Post by jruegg » Sat Feb 06, 2021 5:35 pm

Fainn wrote:
Sat Feb 06, 2021 5:25 pm
coco wrote:
Fri Feb 05, 2021 11:43 am
Early 1600's English culture, and the language that went with it, has been gone from this earth for some time. I recommend something more up-to-date.
That's exactly the attitude that gave us Hillsong and Bethel.
Not even close.
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Re: Old Scofield vs Edition III

Post by Fainn » Sat Feb 06, 2021 5:37 pm

jruegg wrote:
Sat Feb 06, 2021 5:35 pm
Fainn wrote:
Sat Feb 06, 2021 5:25 pm
coco wrote:
Fri Feb 05, 2021 11:43 am
Early 1600's English culture, and the language that went with it, has been gone from this earth for some time. I recommend something more up-to-date.
That's exactly the attitude that gave us Hillsong and Bethel.
Not even close.
I dated a single mom and we took her kids to Vactiona Bible School. Their pledge to the Bible ended with "King James Version, 1611."
Opinions are like butts. Everyone has one, but mine is the best.

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Re: Old Scofield vs Edition III

Post by Fainn » Sat Feb 06, 2021 5:38 pm

I'm not a KJVO, but it was the first Bible I had. I read it so much that it fell apart.
Opinions are like butts. Everyone has one, but mine is the best.

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Re: Old Scofield vs Edition III

Post by jruegg » Sat Feb 06, 2021 5:39 pm

Fainn wrote:
Sat Feb 06, 2021 5:37 pm
jruegg wrote:
Sat Feb 06, 2021 5:35 pm
Fainn wrote:
Sat Feb 06, 2021 5:25 pm
coco wrote:
Fri Feb 05, 2021 11:43 am
Early 1600's English culture, and the language that went with it, has been gone from this earth for some time. I recommend something more up-to-date.
That's exactly the attitude that gave us Hillsong and Bethel.
Not even close.
I dated a single mom and we took her kids to Vactiona Bible School. Their pledge to the Bible ended with "King James Version, 1611."
I don't know you're getting at with this post.
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Re: Old Scofield vs Edition III

Post by Fainn » Sat Feb 06, 2021 5:41 pm

jruegg wrote:
Sat Feb 06, 2021 5:39 pm
Fainn wrote:
Sat Feb 06, 2021 5:37 pm
jruegg wrote:
Sat Feb 06, 2021 5:35 pm
Fainn wrote:
Sat Feb 06, 2021 5:25 pm
coco wrote:
Fri Feb 05, 2021 11:43 am
Early 1600's English culture, and the language that went with it, has been gone from this earth for some time. I recommend something more up-to-date.
That's exactly the attitude that gave us Hillsong and Bethel.
Not even close.
I dated a single mom and we took her kids to Vactiona Bible School. Their pledge to the Bible ended with "King James Version, 1611."
I don't know you're getting at with this post.
I thought it was odd that they would say that. I never heard it in other KJVO churches. I do like it for the historical value, but would probably reccommend NIV to a newcomer.
Opinions are like butts. Everyone has one, but mine is the best.

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Re: Old Scofield vs Edition III

Post by jruegg » Sat Feb 06, 2021 5:46 pm

Fainn wrote:
Sat Feb 06, 2021 5:41 pm
jruegg wrote:
Sat Feb 06, 2021 5:39 pm
Fainn wrote:
Sat Feb 06, 2021 5:37 pm
jruegg wrote:
Sat Feb 06, 2021 5:35 pm
Fainn wrote:
Sat Feb 06, 2021 5:25 pm
coco wrote:
Fri Feb 05, 2021 11:43 am
Early 1600's English culture, and the language that went with it, has been gone from this earth for some time. I recommend something more up-to-date.
That's exactly the attitude that gave us Hillsong and Bethel.
Not even close.
I dated a single mom and we took her kids to Vactiona Bible School. Their pledge to the Bible ended with "King James Version, 1611."
I don't know you're getting at with this post.
I thought it was odd that they would say that. I never heard it in other KJVO churches. I do like it for the historical value, but would probably reccommend NIV to a newcomer.
I got you now. I guess my confusion came straight away with you dating a single mom and took her kids (plural) to VBS. That's a HOT DATE! To a KJVO church to boot! Woo!!
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Re: Old Scofield vs Edition III

Post by coco » Sat Feb 06, 2021 6:13 pm

jruegg wrote:
Sat Feb 06, 2021 5:35 pm
Fainn wrote:
Sat Feb 06, 2021 5:25 pm
coco wrote:
Fri Feb 05, 2021 11:43 am
Early 1600's English culture, and the language that went with it, has been gone from this earth for some time. I recommend something more up-to-date.
That's exactly the attitude that gave us Hillsong and Bethel.
Not even close.
I think of it more as the attitude that led to people being able to read the Bible who do not speak Greek and Hebrew. Christianity not being locked to one culture is a good thing.
There are many terrible attributes of the lowly cob. Not the least of them is that it makes you look like a doof.

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Re: Old Scofield vs Edition III

Post by sweetandsour » Sat Feb 06, 2021 7:11 pm

Jocose wrote:
Fri Feb 05, 2021 3:14 pm
I thought this was going to be about Butt Ben.
At first glance I thought this was going to be about hot peppers.
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Re: Old Scofield vs Edition III

Post by Fainn » Sat Feb 06, 2021 8:11 pm

jruegg wrote:
Sat Feb 06, 2021 5:46 pm
Fainn wrote:
Sat Feb 06, 2021 5:41 pm
jruegg wrote:
Sat Feb 06, 2021 5:39 pm
Fainn wrote:
Sat Feb 06, 2021 5:37 pm
jruegg wrote:
Sat Feb 06, 2021 5:35 pm
Fainn wrote:
Sat Feb 06, 2021 5:25 pm
coco wrote:
Fri Feb 05, 2021 11:43 am
Early 1600's English culture, and the language that went with it, has been gone from this earth for some time. I recommend something more up-to-date.
That's exactly the attitude that gave us Hillsong and Bethel.
Not even close.
I dated a single mom and we took her kids to Vactiona Bible School. Their pledge to the Bible ended with "King James Version, 1611."
I don't know you're getting at with this post.
I thought it was odd that they would say that. I never heard it in other KJVO churches. I do like it for the historical value, but would probably reccommend NIV to a newcomer.
I got you now. I guess my confusion came straight away with you dating a single mom and took her kids (plural) to VBS. That's a HOT DATE! To a KJVO church to boot! Woo!!
There's a reason we're no longer together. lol.
Opinions are like butts. Everyone has one, but mine is the best.

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Re: Old Scofield vs Edition III

Post by Del » Sat Feb 06, 2021 10:08 pm

durangopipe wrote:
Sat Feb 06, 2021 12:31 pm
Del wrote:
Sat Feb 06, 2021 7:18 am
durangopipe wrote:
Fri Feb 05, 2021 9:08 pm
Del wrote:
Fri Feb 05, 2021 8:44 pm
durangopipe wrote:
Fri Feb 05, 2021 1:51 pm
KJV Bible, Lux Leather, Black (No Scofield Notes)

Image

Del will be quick to point out that it's missing a few chapters. :D
Actually, I've never heard of this Schofield guy. I was going to let the knowledgeable folk answer Fain's question.

I appreciate this general advice regarding Bible versions: The version that you will actually read and use is the best one.
=========================================

The original KJV had all 73 of the Sacred Books.

As I understand it, the missing Books weren't taken out of English-language versions of The Bible until early in the 1800's.... and that was a style decision made by printing companies at the time, rather than being any sort of dogmatic declaration by a ministerial authority.
In the original King James Version of the Bible, the apocrypha were included but separated from the other books of the Bible and placed in a separate section to indicate lesser authority.

Thorny theological stuff, Dell.

The KJV Scofield Reference bible was a very commonly used edition of the Bible that included copious linked references and commentary influenced by dispensationalist theology.

I didn’t know what Luther’s Bible included, so I looked it up and found this:

Luther’s Bible included them with a note that said, “Apocrypha: These books are not held equal to the Sacred Scriptures, and yet are useful and good for reading.”
Luther was a "dogmatic declaration by a ministerial authority" unto himself.

Simply.... He was his own pope. Which was fine, as far as that goes. But I have no idea why anyone else should listen to him, when everyone else can go and be his own pope.
That reduces something very weighty and difficult to something inappropriately simple, Del - which this matter of canon most definitely is not.

The books that constitute canon are not consistent throughout Christendom. It’s not just a matter of the difference between Luther’s canon and the current Catholic canon. And it wasn’t just Luther who is responsible for the issue.

The Orthodox Churches’ canons are different from the Protestant and Roman canons. The proper place, use and significance of the several canons and parts of canon divide the Christian world.

Canon was one of the grave matters faced by the early church. The way canon has been presented within traditions has changed in the modern world (the King James bible’s handling of the Apocrypha is an example). It remains a grave and complex matter.

After the mystery of the trinity, few other difficult matters have divided the church as deeply.

This isn’t all about Luther. I don’t believe it’s even mostly about Luther.

Of course, if you believe that every professing Christian (or biblical scholar, or theologian) who does not affirm your own faith tradition’s current understanding of canon is wrong, this difficult matter becomes far less difficult.

But I don’t think you’re the kind of person who would want to say that. Your heart is too big.
I was referring to Luther's penchant for claiming all authority unto himself -- in all matters, not just demoting Books or adding his own words to Sacred Scripture.

I was not aware that the Orthodox canon was different from the Western Apostolic Church. We settled the canon together as One Church, at the end of the Fourth Century. St. Augustine and St. Jerome were there.

Although the Orthodox do count the Psalms differently, but that is not important.... the "chapters" and "verses" are not part of inspired Scripture, anyway. Those were added several centuries later.
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Re: Old Scofield vs Edition III

Post by mustangii » Sat Feb 06, 2021 10:40 pm

https://e-sword.net/downloads.html

you can down load multiple translations and paraphasies (sp). most are free some are paid. I have down loaded all the free ones? Some have the Apocrypha and I enjoy reading those, even though I am a Christian that worships in the Baptist tradition, lol.

https://estudysource.com/platform/site/ ... index.aspx

Download page for e-sword commentaries and others items.

most are free, some are paid

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Re: Old Scofield vs Edition III

Post by Jocose » Sun Feb 07, 2021 1:38 pm

sweetandsour wrote:
Sat Feb 06, 2021 7:11 pm
Jocose wrote:
Fri Feb 05, 2021 3:14 pm
I thought this was going to be about Butt Ben.
At first glance I thought this was going to be about hot peppers.
:lol: :lol: :lol:
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Re: Old Scofield vs Edition III

Post by Fainn » Sun Feb 07, 2021 8:43 pm

Jocose wrote:
Sun Feb 07, 2021 1:38 pm
sweetandsour wrote:
Sat Feb 06, 2021 7:11 pm
Jocose wrote:
Fri Feb 05, 2021 3:14 pm
I thought this was going to be about Butt Ben.
At first glance I thought this was going to be about hot peppers.
:lol: :lol: :lol:
Flea and Anthony Keidis are the only true hot peppers.
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Re: Old Scofield vs Edition III

Post by tuttle » Mon Feb 08, 2021 9:52 am

This thread sounds like a plan for a pleasant evening.

Eating spicy food while reading a passage on Isaac in the KJV with Luther's commentary on Genesis.
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Re: Old Scofield vs Edition III

Post by Cleon » Mon Feb 08, 2021 10:00 am

tuttle wrote:
Mon Feb 08, 2021 9:52 am
This thread sounds like a plan for a pleasant evening.

Eating spicy food while reading a passage on Isaac in the KJV with Luther's commentary on Genesis.
And beer. Lots of beer.
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Re: Old Scofield vs Edition III

Post by Sir Moose » Mon Feb 08, 2021 1:29 pm

Fainn wrote:
Sat Feb 06, 2021 8:11 pm
jruegg wrote:
Sat Feb 06, 2021 5:46 pm
Fainn wrote:
Sat Feb 06, 2021 5:41 pm
jruegg wrote:
Sat Feb 06, 2021 5:39 pm
Fainn wrote:
Sat Feb 06, 2021 5:37 pm
jruegg wrote:
Sat Feb 06, 2021 5:35 pm
Fainn wrote:
Sat Feb 06, 2021 5:25 pm
coco wrote:
Fri Feb 05, 2021 11:43 am
Early 1600's English culture, and the language that went with it, has been gone from this earth for some time. I recommend something more up-to-date.
That's exactly the attitude that gave us Hillsong and Bethel.
Not even close.
I dated a single mom and we took her kids to Vactiona Bible School. Their pledge to the Bible ended with "King James Version, 1611."
I don't know you're getting at with this post.
I thought it was odd that they would say that. I never heard it in other KJVO churches. I do like it for the historical value, but would probably reccommend NIV to a newcomer.
I got you now. I guess my confusion came straight away with you dating a single mom and took her kids (plural) to VBS. That's a HOT DATE! To a KJVO church to boot! Woo!!
There's a reason we're no longer together. lol.
Mary wouldn't have it?
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