Happy

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Adam Z
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Re: Happy

Post by Adam Z » Wed Dec 19, 2018 8:54 am

Nature of a Man wrote:
Tue Dec 18, 2018 10:44 pm
Adam Z wrote:
Tue Dec 18, 2018 4:53 pm
Nature of a Man wrote:
Tue Dec 18, 2018 6:13 am
Adam Z wrote:
Wed Dec 05, 2018 9:31 am
Pietism... ugh. Glad to hear you've been liberated from that, Fainn.
How do you define Pietism just for the record? I did a quick Google and didn't find a workable term.
Pietism is an ideology that is preoccupied with piety. It is that approach to Christianity that is preoccupied with the interior of the Christian life. Should is pietism's main focus. It is about what we should be doing, and how we should go about doing it and where we should be as compared to where we are. Pietism specializes in pointing out the exact distance between should and am. The issue with pietism is not only what it emphasizes, but also what it minimizes. The concern is that Christ's work stands more in the background than in the foreground (Colossians 2:20-23). Most information and instruction within pietism is aimed at how to live. Duty overshadows identity. Pietism begins with the question "What must I do?" Thus, obligation precedes assurance, and this order of priorities leads to a confusion of theological categories and despair in the life of the believer.
Ah, so something similar to a "salvation through works" worldview?
In effect - yes. Not necessarily overtly, but rather subconsciously.

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Goose55
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Re: Happy

Post by Goose55 » Wed Dec 19, 2018 9:14 am

Adam Z wrote:
Tue Dec 18, 2018 4:53 pm
Nature of a Man wrote:
Tue Dec 18, 2018 6:13 am
Adam Z wrote:
Wed Dec 05, 2018 9:31 am
Pietism... ugh. Glad to hear you've been liberated from that, Fainn.
How do you define Pietism just for the record? I did a quick Google and didn't find a workable term.
Pietism is an ideology that is preoccupied with piety. It is that approach to Christianity that is preoccupied with the interior of the Christian life. Should is pietism's main focus. It is about what we should be doing, and how we should go about doing it and where we should be as compared to where we are. Pietism specializes in pointing out the exact distance between should and am. The issue with pietism is not only what it emphasizes, but also what it minimizes. The concern is that Christ's work stands more in the background than in the foreground (Colossians 2:20-23). Most information and instruction within pietism is aimed at how to live. Duty overshadows identity. Pietism begins with the question "What must I do?" Thus, obligation precedes assurance, and this order of priorities leads to a confusion of theological categories and despair in the life of the believer.
Putting the cart before the horse. This totally ignores the truth of "Christ in you, the hope of glory." Just another form of nasty legalism holding so rigidly to the Law as if it were the source of life.
"At present we're on the wrong side of the door. But all the pages of the New Testament are rustling with the rumor that it will not always be so." ~ C.S. Lewis

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Adam Z
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Re: Happy

Post by Adam Z » Wed Dec 19, 2018 10:01 am

Goose55 wrote:
Wed Dec 19, 2018 9:14 am
Adam Z wrote:
Tue Dec 18, 2018 4:53 pm
Nature of a Man wrote:
Tue Dec 18, 2018 6:13 am
Adam Z wrote:
Wed Dec 05, 2018 9:31 am
Pietism... ugh. Glad to hear you've been liberated from that, Fainn.
How do you define Pietism just for the record? I did a quick Google and didn't find a workable term.
Pietism is an ideology that is preoccupied with piety. It is that approach to Christianity that is preoccupied with the interior of the Christian life. Should is pietism's main focus. It is about what we should be doing, and how we should go about doing it and where we should be as compared to where we are. Pietism specializes in pointing out the exact distance between should and am. The issue with pietism is not only what it emphasizes, but also what it minimizes. The concern is that Christ's work stands more in the background than in the foreground (Colossians 2:20-23). Most information and instruction within pietism is aimed at how to live. Duty overshadows identity. Pietism begins with the question "What must I do?" Thus, obligation precedes assurance, and this order of priorities leads to a confusion of theological categories and despair in the life of the believer.
Putting the cart before the horse. This totally ignores the truth of "Christ in you, the hope of glory." Just another form of nasty legalism holding so rigidly to the Law as if it were the source of life.
Agreed. I had to stop reading Oswald Chambers' My Utmost For His Highest for this reason. Not saying the book is all garbage, because there's some really good stuff in there too, but it's also rife with pietism. So many of the daily readings are basically a fragment of a scripture verse followed by a brief exposition on how what you're doing is wrong and you just need to try harder to be the person who you're called to be in Christ - if only you tried a little harder to be more holy, you'd be more victorious in the christian life... It kinda wears one down after a while, and gets depressing - well, it did for me, at least.

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hugodrax
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Re: Happy

Post by hugodrax » Wed Dec 19, 2018 10:16 am

Adam Z wrote:
Wed Dec 19, 2018 10:01 am
Goose55 wrote:
Wed Dec 19, 2018 9:14 am
Adam Z wrote:
Tue Dec 18, 2018 4:53 pm
Nature of a Man wrote:
Tue Dec 18, 2018 6:13 am
Adam Z wrote:
Wed Dec 05, 2018 9:31 am
Pietism... ugh. Glad to hear you've been liberated from that, Fainn.
How do you define Pietism just for the record? I did a quick Google and didn't find a workable term.
Pietism is an ideology that is preoccupied with piety. It is that approach to Christianity that is preoccupied with the interior of the Christian life. Should is pietism's main focus. It is about what we should be doing, and how we should go about doing it and where we should be as compared to where we are. Pietism specializes in pointing out the exact distance between should and am. The issue with pietism is not only what it emphasizes, but also what it minimizes. The concern is that Christ's work stands more in the background than in the foreground (Colossians 2:20-23). Most information and instruction within pietism is aimed at how to live. Duty overshadows identity. Pietism begins with the question "What must I do?" Thus, obligation precedes assurance, and this order of priorities leads to a confusion of theological categories and despair in the life of the believer.
Putting the cart before the horse. This totally ignores the truth of "Christ in you, the hope of glory." Just another form of nasty legalism holding so rigidly to the Law as if it were the source of life.
Agreed. I had to stop reading Oswald Chambers' My Utmost For His Highest for this reason. Not saying the book is all garbage, because there's some really good stuff in there too, but it's also rife with pietism. So many of the daily readings are basically a fragment of a scripture verse followed by a brief exposition on how what you're doing is wrong and you just need to try harder to be the person who you're called to be in Christ - if only you tried a little harder to be more holy, you'd be more victorious in the christian life... It kinda wears one down after a while, and gets depressing - well, it did for me, at least.
Yeah, that’s a drag cause you’re totally awesome, man. I mean really cool. You’re caring and sweet and kind and Jesus loves you. What more could Jesus want? Just focus on yourself more.
Etiam mihi opinio anserem perirent.

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Adam Z
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Re: Happy

Post by Adam Z » Wed Dec 19, 2018 10:57 am

hugodrax wrote:
Wed Dec 19, 2018 10:16 am
Adam Z wrote:
Wed Dec 19, 2018 10:01 am
Goose55 wrote:
Wed Dec 19, 2018 9:14 am
Adam Z wrote:
Tue Dec 18, 2018 4:53 pm
Nature of a Man wrote:
Tue Dec 18, 2018 6:13 am
Adam Z wrote:
Wed Dec 05, 2018 9:31 am
Pietism... ugh. Glad to hear you've been liberated from that, Fainn.
How do you define Pietism just for the record? I did a quick Google and didn't find a workable term.
Pietism is an ideology that is preoccupied with piety. It is that approach to Christianity that is preoccupied with the interior of the Christian life. Should is pietism's main focus. It is about what we should be doing, and how we should go about doing it and where we should be as compared to where we are. Pietism specializes in pointing out the exact distance between should and am. The issue with pietism is not only what it emphasizes, but also what it minimizes. The concern is that Christ's work stands more in the background than in the foreground (Colossians 2:20-23). Most information and instruction within pietism is aimed at how to live. Duty overshadows identity. Pietism begins with the question "What must I do?" Thus, obligation precedes assurance, and this order of priorities leads to a confusion of theological categories and despair in the life of the believer.
Putting the cart before the horse. This totally ignores the truth of "Christ in you, the hope of glory." Just another form of nasty legalism holding so rigidly to the Law as if it were the source of life.
Agreed. I had to stop reading Oswald Chambers' My Utmost For His Highest for this reason. Not saying the book is all garbage, because there's some really good stuff in there too, but it's also rife with pietism. So many of the daily readings are basically a fragment of a scripture verse followed by a brief exposition on how what you're doing is wrong and you just need to try harder to be the person who you're called to be in Christ - if only you tried a little harder to be more holy, you'd be more victorious in the christian life... It kinda wears one down after a while, and gets depressing - well, it did for me, at least.
Yeah, that’s a drag cause you’re totally awesome, man. I mean really cool. You’re caring and sweet and kind and Jesus loves you. What more could Jesus want? Just focus on yourself more.
There's a context here that either you're missing, or I've just not communicated it effectively. I'm most definitely not supporting the kind of christianity that denies progressive sanctification & just seeks all the warm, fuzzy feelings because "Jesus loves me and that's all I need" (Robert Schuler, Joel Osteen, etc.). The point is that progressive sanctification is a monergistic thing, and pietism and it's adherents would make it synergistic.

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hugodrax
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Re: Happy

Post by hugodrax » Wed Dec 19, 2018 11:20 am

Adam Z wrote:
Wed Dec 19, 2018 10:57 am
hugodrax wrote:
Wed Dec 19, 2018 10:16 am
Adam Z wrote:
Wed Dec 19, 2018 10:01 am
Goose55 wrote:
Wed Dec 19, 2018 9:14 am
Adam Z wrote:
Tue Dec 18, 2018 4:53 pm
Nature of a Man wrote:
Tue Dec 18, 2018 6:13 am
Adam Z wrote:
Wed Dec 05, 2018 9:31 am
Pietism... ugh. Glad to hear you've been liberated from that, Fainn.
How do you define Pietism just for the record? I did a quick Google and didn't find a workable term.
Pietism is an ideology that is preoccupied with piety. It is that approach to Christianity that is preoccupied with the interior of the Christian life. Should is pietism's main focus. It is about what we should be doing, and how we should go about doing it and where we should be as compared to where we are. Pietism specializes in pointing out the exact distance between should and am. The issue with pietism is not only what it emphasizes, but also what it minimizes. The concern is that Christ's work stands more in the background than in the foreground (Colossians 2:20-23). Most information and instruction within pietism is aimed at how to live. Duty overshadows identity. Pietism begins with the question "What must I do?" Thus, obligation precedes assurance, and this order of priorities leads to a confusion of theological categories and despair in the life of the believer.
Putting the cart before the horse. This totally ignores the truth of "Christ in you, the hope of glory." Just another form of nasty legalism holding so rigidly to the Law as if it were the source of life.
Agreed. I had to stop reading Oswald Chambers' My Utmost For His Highest for this reason. Not saying the book is all garbage, because there's some really good stuff in there too, but it's also rife with pietism. So many of the daily readings are basically a fragment of a scripture verse followed by a brief exposition on how what you're doing is wrong and you just need to try harder to be the person who you're called to be in Christ - if only you tried a little harder to be more holy, you'd be more victorious in the christian life... It kinda wears one down after a while, and gets depressing - well, it did for me, at least.
Yeah, that’s a drag cause you’re totally awesome, man. I mean really cool. You’re caring and sweet and kind and Jesus loves you. What more could Jesus want? Just focus on yourself more.
There's a context here that either you're missing, or I've just not communicated it effectively. I'm most definitely not supporting the kind of christianity that denies progressive sanctification & just seeks all the warm, fuzzy feelings because "Jesus loves me and that's all I need" (Robert Schuler, Joel Osteen, etc.). The point is that progressive sanctification is a monergistic thing, and pietism and it's adherents would make it synergistic.
Or your humor chip malfunctioned. I should rarely be taken too seriously.

On the other hand, and again in a humorous vein, not to be taken too seriously as we all work it out in this vale of tears, Protestantism in general is hard for me to follow and often makes me smile a bit.

From my vantage point, it looks like you've rejected as "legalism" rules and rubrics that deviate from your accepted, quite detailed rules and rubrics. You're defining how the Holy Ghost operates, arent you?

Dont take any of what I say too seriously. Theology is the devil's playground in that it can cause us to argue where we don't need to. I mean no offense to you, sir.
Etiam mihi opinio anserem perirent.

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